TOTALLY GEEKED!

Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
Post Info TOPIC: Christian Women: Gifted to Lead


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 25897
Date:
Christian Women: Gifted to Lead
Permalink  
 


Christian Women: Gifted to Lead

Posted: 03/25/2015 11:07 am EDT Updated: 03/25/2015 11:59 am EDT

pin_icon_onhover.pngFEMALE PASTOR
Steve Nagy / Design Pics via Getty Images
                                     
 
 
 

I am a pastor. Because I am a woman, there are many Christian faith traditions where those words would be impossible for me to say. Thankfully, women are welcomed and valued as pastors, ministers and leaders in the Evangelical Covenant Church (ECC), in which I am ordained.

pin_icon_onhover.png2015-03-24-1427217161-3375551-MaehiresBrianKammerzelt0281.jpg

It is true that gender can be, and often is, an issue no matter your chosen field of work, but it feels especially true in conservative Christianity where many prominent leaders still hold fast to the belief that women shouldn't hold leadership roles or mantles of authority. Those women who do lead, serve and pastor are frequently aware of the fact that many find their jobs, ministries and life choices wrong or even sinful.

I recently heard a story of a woman who served as a chaplain in a Catholic hospital. Even though she was a Protestant minister, she was asked to wear a collar. This is not all that unusual. But during one of her evening rounds in February, when a surgeon joined her in the elevator he asked in a condescending and critical tone, "What is this, Halloween?" Another time at the same hospital, a doctor made a joke and asked if he should address the minister as "Father." Still another hospital staff person suggested that she should quit her job and "go home to have children" where her gifts would be better utilized. One might find some humor in these types of scenarios, but if I look at the underlying issues and assumptions, they make me cringe.

Even among those who support women in ministry, there can be a blind spot when it comes to understanding the long history and entrenched views about women in positions of leadership and influence, particularly in the church. A friend recently shared her experience of asking a leader in the church for advice on pursuing leadership opportunities. She was told that if she were good at her job, opportunities would find her. This may be true for men, but it is frequently untrue for women, particularly in conservative Christian communities. Often, women are not invited to the table, regardless of how accomplished or experienced they are.

In many conservative fundamentalist or evangelical churches, women are allowed to serve in any capacity as missionaries. Women are given roles to serve by leading worship and are often permitted, if not encouraged, to teach the Bible as missionaries or evangelists externally. But in the local church context, these same women are often blocked from holding mantles of leadership. It is common for women to be called as directors of children's ministries or care ministries (two areas where women's stereotypical strengths may be showcased) but are often unable to rise to positions of authority. These ministries are critical and women who serve alongside of children and in compassion ministries should be celebrated! My concern is when women's giftedness is limited to only serving in these capacities.

Many churches believe that a woman can only be in positions of power if there's a man with a mantle of authority over her. This is not only harmful for women, but it limits the diversity of the church. In doing so, it hinders our ability to worship at our fullest potential. It hinders our ability to minister to our communities.

Romans 12:6-8 says:

We have different gifts, according to the grace given to each of us. If your gift is prophesying, then prophesy in accordance with your faith; if it is serving, then serve; if it is teaching, then teach; if it is to encourage, then give encouragement; if it is giving, then give generously; if it is to lead, do it diligently; if it is to show mercy, do it cheerfully. (NIV)

 
 

Women... and men... all of the people God created in His image... have been called to use their gifts. It is clear from this passage in scripture: when people are blessed with the gifts of leadership, they are called -- regardless of gender -- to lead diligently.

By limiting the roles of women in the church, we are dismissing this beautiful diversity of God's creation. We are missing out on experiencing a blessing from God by limiting whom we allow to participate in the leadership of the church.

This Women's History Month, let us come together to celebrate women by encouraging them to fulfill whatever roles God has called them to fulfill. Celebrate the women who lead and teach you well. Acknowledge their gifts and your own.

If you are unsure of your feelings about women in Church leadership, I encourage you to check out these great resources, How I Changed My Mind about Women in Leadership: Compelling Stories from Prominent Evangelicals (Zondervan) and Discovering Biblical Equality: Complementarity without Hierarchy (InterVarsity Press).

I also invite you to join me, my co-authors of Forgive Us: Confessions of a Compromised Faith and other faith leaders in a twitter teach-in on the sins of the church against women. Wednesday, March 25, 9 pm Eastern. @ForgiveUsBook, #ForgiveUsBook

 



__________________

https://politicsandstuff.proboards.com/



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 25897
Date:
Permalink  
 

How do you feel about Women as Pastors and church leaders?

__________________

https://politicsandstuff.proboards.com/



On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Status: Offline
Posts: 27192
Date:
Permalink  
 

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:

How do you feel about Women as Pastors and church leaders?


 Women are to be the backbone of the church, not the mouth.  The Bible calls for men to be the pastors.

And I know this will start a whole argument about sexism in the Bible, blah, blah, blah.  But the Bible treats women as wonderful gifts to their their husbands, and children.  It requires that the men care for them, cherish them, love them as GOD loved the church - Jesus died for us.  God makes men responsible for much more, with much more to answer for.  Those verses in the Bible give women basically one rule - respect your husbands.  Then he goes on for almost an entire chapter about a husbands duty to his wife.  And because of this responsibility, the men are supposed to be the head of the church, as well.



__________________

LawyerLady

 

I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you. 



My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline
Posts: 38325
Date:
Permalink  
 

I am torn on this. God used women in the Bible to bring the new of Jesus.

To give birth of course but also to announce His resurrection. And at other times.

I believe God can use any one to bring His message.

But I also feel men should be the leaders.

Like I said, I am torn.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 25897
Date:
Permalink  
 

There are instances in the Bible of women's leadership. Deborah was one of the Judges for example. Jesus did hold women in very high esteem. Women were the first ones to witness the Resurrection. I think the real issue isn't women leadership. I think the real problem today is a serious lack of male leadership. The lack of male leadership is destroying homes, marriages, society, etc. When men just sit back and not take an active role in leadership, then women put that on their backs and lead the way. There is a serious problem with men owning responsibility, accountability and leadership. And, far too many men nowadays willing to sit on their arses while women lead the charge.

__________________

https://politicsandstuff.proboards.com/



On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Status: Offline
Posts: 27192
Date:
Permalink  
 

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:

There are instances in the Bible of women's leadership. Deborah was one of the Judges for example. Jesus did hold women in very high esteem. Women were the first ones to witness the Resurrection. I think the real issue isn't women leadership. I think the real problem today is a serious lack of male leadership. The lack of male leadership is destroying homes, marriages, society, etc. When men just sit back and not take an active role in leadership, then women put that on their backs and lead the way. There is a serious problem with men owning responsibility, accountability and leadership. And, far too many men nowadays willing to sit on their arses while women lead the charge.


 Yes.  That is why I don't think the Bible is sexist, just that God assigns different roles.  Women are called to lead other young women certainly.  Women should be in charge of Bible studies and children's services, etc.  But the Bible is very clear on the roles of men as leaders of the church - that really isn't ambiguous.



__________________

LawyerLady

 

I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you. 



Itty bitty's Grammy

Status: Offline
Posts: 28124
Date:
Permalink  
 

One of our pastors is a woman. She is amazing.

flan

__________________

You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.



On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Status: Offline
Posts: 27192
Date:
Permalink  
 

This is an interesting discussion about it -

Women pastors - what does the Bible say?

The only way to have a productive dialogue on the women pastors issue is to discuss it biblically. Yes, undeniably, there are men whose views on the issue are clouded by chauvinism. At the same time, there are men and women on both sides of the discussion. So, it should never be assumed that one holds a particular view due to latent chauvinism. The issue should be decided based on what the Bible teaches, not on who can make the strongest ad hominem attack.

The key passage on the women pastors issue is 1 Timothy 2:11-12, which reads, "Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet." At its face, this passage is abundantly clear. Paul restricts women from teaching or having spiritual authority over men. While it is not explicitly laid out in the text, the focus seems to be on the concept of pastoring/shepherding. A pastor's duties are primarily teaching and leading. It is this shepherding role over men that God, through Paul, restricts to men.

There are several lines of argument against this interpretation of the women pastors issue in 1 Timothy 2:11-12:

(1) Women were uneducated at that time, and therefore not qualified to be teachers. The passage nowhere mentions education. Education is not mentioned as a qualification for church leadership in 1 Timothy 3:1-13 or Titus 1:6-9. If education was a requirement, few, if any, of Jesus' disciples would have been qualified.

(2) Paul was only dealing with Artemis worship at Timothy's church in Ephesus. The context, and all of 1 Timothy for that matter, nowhere mention Artemis or the prominence of women in the worship of Artemis. If there was a problem with women usurping authority over men in the church in Ephesus, Paul would have addressed it directly.

(3) Paul is referring to husbands and wives, not men and women. Wives are not to teach or have authority over their husbands. The Greek words could refer to husbands and wives, but the context indicates otherwise. Are only husbands to lift up holy hands in prayer? Are only wives to dress modestly (1 Timothy 2:8-10)? The immediate context indicates that men and women in general are the subject, not husbands and wives exclusively.

(4) There are women in the Bible who served in ways that contradict this interpretation of 1 Timothy 2:11-12. Miriam, Deborah, Huldah, Priscilla, and Phoebe are the most commonly given examples. Ultimately, Miriam, Deborah, and Huldah are meaningless to the issue, as Paul is addressing leadership in the church. Leadership in old covenant Israel is not the subject at hand. In regards to Priscilla and Phoebe, the New Testament nowhere describes them serving in a way that contradicts 1 Timothy 2:11-12. Priscilla, with her husband Aquila, discipled Apollos in their home (Acts 18:26). Phoebe is simply identified as a servant/deaconess of the church (Romans 16:1).

(5) Galatians 3:28 says that men and women are equal in God's eyes. Men and women are absolutely equal in God's eyes, but that is not the issue. The subject of Galatians 3:28 is equality in Christ, equal access to the salvation Christ offers. Men and women, Jews and Gentiles, slave and free are absolutely equal in this context. Church leadership is not the subject of Galatians 3:28. Further, we cannot take one verse and use it to cancel out another verse. Both Galatians 3:28 and 1 Timothy 2:11-12 are absolutely true. They do not contradict each other.

If education, culture, or marriage are not the reason for the restriction on women in 1 Timothy 2:11-12, what is the reason? The answer is given in the next two verses: "For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived" (1 Timothy 2:13-14). The order of creation and the nature of the fall impacts spiritual leadership in the church, and in the family (see Ephesians 5:22-33). Women are not to teach or have spiritual authority over men because women were created to be "helpers" to men and because Eve was deceived into sin. Through creation, and because of the Fall, God has chosen to give men the primary teaching authority in the church.

So, what exactly does this mean practically? What are women restricted from doing? The clear implication is that women are not to serve in any role which involves the authoritative spiritual teaching of men. By this definition, the role of teaching pastor/shepherd is reserved for men. This is confirmed in the two passages which deal specifically with the qualifications for church leadership (1 Timothy 3:1-13; Titus 1:6-9). Church leaders are described as the "husband of one wife," "a man whose children believe," and "men worthy of respect."

Rather than focusing on what ministries women are restricted from, the focus should be on the multitude of ways God calls and gifts women to serve. Women are nowhere restricted from proclaiming the gospel to the lost (Acts 1:8; 1 Peter 3:15). Women are encouraged to teach other women (Titus 2:3-5). Women are nowhere restricted from teaching children. Women seem to excel, far beyond men, in some of the spiritual gifts and fruit of the Spirit (1 Corinthians 12; Galatians 5:22-23). Women being restricted from spiritual teaching authority over men is not a punishment. Rather, it is a refocusing to the ministries, skills, and gifts God with which blesses women.


Read more: http://www.compellingtruth.org/women-pastors.html#ixzz3Vai2qy3N



__________________

LawyerLady

 

I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you. 



On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Status: Offline
Posts: 27192
Date:
Permalink  
 

Just as a tangent - even though polygamy was accepted in Biblical times, notice that God describes church leaders as the "husband of one wife".



__________________

LawyerLady

 

I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you. 



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 2672
Date:
Permalink  
 

The Bible was written down many centuries ago, and reflects the cultural beliefs of an ancient time. Those cultural beliefs that oppress women should not apply any more, and enlightened congregations do not allow them to apply.

My sister is a UCC minister, does a great job, and is well-respected for it.



__________________

No matter how educated, talented, rich or cool you believe you are,

how you treat people ultimately tells all.

Integrity is everything.



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 1586
Date:
Permalink  
 


have had the good fortune to know many spiritual people in this life--men and women--the Almighty speaks to us in different ways, if we're listening

__________________

" the only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. "--edmund burke

 



Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 2672
Date:
Permalink  
 

burns07 wrote:


have had the good fortune to know many spiritual people in this life--men and women--the Almighty speaks to us in different ways, if we're listening


 I agree.



__________________

No matter how educated, talented, rich or cool you believe you are,

how you treat people ultimately tells all.

Integrity is everything.

Page 1 of 1  sorted by
 
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.



Create your own FREE Forum
Report Abuse
Powered by ActiveBoard