TOTALLY GEEKED!

huskerbb · Guru

Ok, so I was in line behind...

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Well, not to defend them but there's one card for two things. You can get food stamps AND child support on the same card. Do I think you should spend your child support on cigarette's? No. But then who's to say she hasn't gone without all week so she could pay all the bills on time and take care of all her responsibilities and just now got her child support. I don't know of anyone who gets child support and keeps it totally separate from all the other money. It all goes into one pot and you pay for everything out of that one pot.

OTOH, there is no way food stamps will pay for cigarettes unless the store is doing something illegal. So if all she had was food stamps she's not getting cigarettes. Ain't no way. And if the store allows it then it's a felony for both the store and the woman if they get found out.

just Czech · Give Me Grand's!

We have a couple from here, unmarried, both on disability, on welfare, food stamps and everything else they can get their hands on, who frequently go up to the casino and gamble all evening.

Yes, that is our tax money as well.

I am always ticked when I see them up there gambling away my money.

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

I agree it's irritating. But the system allows it. I know tons of people on disability who could work if they really wanted to. My ex included. It's not just food stamps. All the social programs are being abused.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
Well, not to defend them but there's one card for two things. You can get food stamps AND child support on the same card. Do I think you should spend your child support on cigarette's? No. But then who's to say she hasn't gone without all week so she could pay all the bills on time and take care of all her responsibilities and just now got her child support. I don't know of anyone who gets child support and keeps it totally separate from all the other money. It all goes into one pot and you pay for everything out of that one pot.

OTOH, there is no way food stamps will pay for cigarettes unless the store is doing something illegal. So if all she had was food stamps she's not getting cigarettes. Ain't no way. And if the store allows it then it's a felony for both the store and the woman if they get found out.

My dad owned a grocery store. People would bring in their food stamps, buy a lollipop and get change. Then buy cigarrettes or walk over to the bar.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I agree it's irritating. But the system allows it. I know tons of people on disability who could work if they really wanted to. My ex included. It's not just food stamps. All the social programs are being abused.

Of course, but we are apparently not allowed to complain about fraud and corruption and waste because apparently that hurts their whittle feelings.

I know what to do_sometimes · Frozen Sucks!

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
Well, not to defend them but there's one card for two things. You can get food stamps AND child support on the same card. Do I think you should spend your child support on cigarette's? No. But then who's to say she hasn't gone without all week so she could pay all the bills on time and take care of all her responsibilities and just now got her child support. I don't know of anyone who gets child support and keeps it totally separate from all the other money. It all goes into one pot and you pay for everything out of that one pot.

OTOH, there is no way food stamps will pay for cigarettes unless the store is doing something illegal. So if all she had was food stamps she's not getting cigarettes. Ain't no way. And if the store allows it then it's a felony for both the store and the woman if they get found out.
My dad owned a grocery store. People would bring in their food stamps, buy a lollipop and get change. Then buy cigarrettes or walk over to the bar.

Well that doesn't happen anymore since the invention of the ETB card. Unless of course the clerk is committing fraud so there is that.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Yeah, this was before EBT cards. But, lets' face it, they are all masters at scamming the system and getting what they want.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Strange. Back 25 years ago, it was the funny paper "money" food stamps. You didn't get change back from that either.

If something was 3.06 you either found .06 or you gave them another whole "dollar" and you lost the .94.

Fast forward to the cards, if it is food stamps, then you can't buy it if you can't eat it.

If it is TANF, then that is different. It is like an allowance. Of course you shouldn't use it for non essential things, but it isn't prohibited.

Also the unemployment debit card can look an awfully lot like the card that you get food stamps, TANF and child support on.

Yes, fraud happens.

Yes, people misuse funds all the time.

Doesn't mean every single one of the people you see with a card from a government agency is "working the system".

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Yeah, see that's the problem. We can talk about fraud, abuse and corruption WITHOUT constantly having to say, Well not every person abuses the system. Yeah, we know that, blah, blah. We need to talk about and weed out the frauds in an aggressive and punitive manner. But, for Dems, it is buying votes. Here's yer welfare, dont' care if you snort it, drink it, inject it, smoke it. Vote for me.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

That's the thing.

Unless you know what account that card is drawing on, you don't know if it is fraud or welfare.

Absolutely talk about fraud.

Call the hot line and report abuse when you suspect it.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

lilyofcourse wrote:
That's the thing.

Unless you know what account that card is drawing on, you don't know if it is fraud or welfare.

Absolutely talk about fraud.

Call the hot line and report abuse when you suspect it.

Uh huh. The Govt doens't CARE about the fraud Lilly. What part of that aren't you getting? It is a way to buy votes, so they don't care. But, if i see an able bodied person whipping out their laminated govt gold plated Visas, then yeah, that pisses off us working people.

huskerbb · Guru

She SAID EBT card--not TANF, not child support--EBT.

TrudyML · Guru

I have pulled the EBT cards out of my bank ATM. They get cash off them. I go crazy here where I live.

ed11563 · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
That's the thing.

Unless you know what account that card is drawing on, you don't know if it is fraud or welfare.

Absolutely talk about fraud.

Call the hot line and report abuse when you suspect it.

Uh huh. The Govt doesn't CARE about the fraud Lilly. What part of that aren't you getting? It is a way to buy votes, so they don't care. But, if i see an able bodied person whipping out their laminated govt gold plated Visas, then yeah, that pisses off us working people.

I suspect that you're reading too much into the idea that some (many?) government employees don't seem to care about fraud.

In many or most cases, they only care about keeping their jobs and continuing to get paid.

"Rocking the boat" is often the best way to get fired.

"Making waves", same thing.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I agree it's irritating. But the system allows it. I know tons of people on disability who could work if they really wanted to. My ex included. It's not just food stamps. All the social programs are being abused.
Of course, but we are apparently not allowed to complain about fraud and corruption and waste because apparently that hurts their whittle feelings.

Now even you know that's BS.

flan

TrudyML · Guru

I live in the second largest city in MA. I listen on the bus how they all coach each other how to get SSI, etc. Amazing, really.

Domestic Engineer · Guru

No matter how you cut it, cigarettes and alcohol are not needs, especially if your using my tax dollars to pay your other bills.

With the $12 she paid for 2 packs of cigarettes, she could have paid for an entire meal, school lunches for a week or more, gas in the car to get to a job, a bottle of allergy meds or many other necessary items.

FNW · Guru

I guess I don't get out much. I never heard of any of these cards before. This is quite interesting...

huskerbb · Guru

Domestic Engineer wrote:
No matter how you cut it, cigarettes and alcohol are not needs, especially if your using my tax dollars to pay your other bills.

With the $12 she paid for 2 packs of cigarettes, she could have paid for an entire meal, school lunches for a week or more, gas in the car to get to a job, a bottle of allergy meds or many other necessary items.

Exactly. It's really irrelevant what dollars are actually used. It all goes into and comes out of the same "pot" at the end of the day.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

You know, I have worked my whole life for health insurance (more or less). After the accident, I did not qualify for ANY kind of assistance. So be it.

I don't care what poison you choose to put in your body as long as YOU pay for it.

flan

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

flan327 wrote:
You know, I have worked my whole life for health insurance (more or less). After the accident, I did not qualify for ANY kind of assistance. So be it.

I don't care what poison you choose to put in your body as long as YOU pay for it.

flan

flan, that's because they knew you were willing to work.

The problem with the system is that people are playing chicken with the government and winning. They are being more stubborn about not working and playing the system than the government is about making them and calling their bluff. Unless the nanny state is willing to let people truly suffer to the point of making them better themselves, it's not going to happen. It will continue and more and more people will learn the game until the system collapses.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lawyerlady wrote:
flan327 wrote:
You know, I have worked my whole life for health insurance (more or less). After the accident, I did not qualify for ANY kind of assistance. So be it.

I don't care what poison you choose to put in your body as long as YOU pay for it.

flan
flan, that's because they knew you were willing to work.
The problem with the system is that people are playing chicken with the government and winning. They are being more stubborn about not working and playing the system than the government is about making them and calling their bluff. Unless the nanny state is willing to let people truly suffer to the point of making them better themselves, it's not going to happen. It will continue and more and more people will learn the game until the system collapses.

My dad worked 2 jobs when I was growing up, so that's true.

I don't think it's very "Liberal" of me, but I get absolutely livid seeing people who CAN work, but think they are owed a living.

flan

TrudyML · Guru

Don't move where I live, flannie. And the Puerto Ricans just game all day. Everything.

Mary Zombie · Guru

She may get welfare or disability income along with food stamps but that usually goes into your bank account. Theoretically she could use her bank card to by smokes. Perhaps she pulled out the wrong card? But I still think it sucks.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

TrudyML wrote:
Don't move where I live, flannie. And the Puerto Ricans just game all day. Everything.

I worked at an inner-city library for 10+ years.

Mondays were "file for welfare" days. Our patrons would come in, grab a phone book & list "jobs" that they had applied for...

I just can't wrap my mind around living like that.

flan

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

lilyofcourse wrote:
That's the thing.

Unless you know what account that card is drawing on, you don't know if it is fraud or welfare.

Absolutely talk about fraud.

Call the hot line and report abuse when you suspect it.

I actually have to agree with Lily. You get one card and it is for TWO things. At the beginning of the month your food stamps are loaded onto it as well as your TANF (welfare check). You cannot buy smokes with your food stamps unless the shop person is doing something illegal. But you can buy anything with the cash that is loaded on your card. Think of it like a debit card that accesses both your checking and savings account. Two different accounts for the same person. Again, I'm not defending these people. Just trying to explain how it works. And no, if you need help you probably shouldn't be smoking.

Welfare isn't the only social program abused though. There are tons out there. And whoever said they compared notes is correct. Heck, you can go down to the welfare office and they'll give you a list of agencies that will give you free stuff. We have flyer's all over town. And it's on the internet here. It's not a big secret. People abuse these programs because we let them. And I have no problem with people talking about it. The programs need to be revamped. All of them.

There is a woman at my church who runs the food bank. She's always busy. She's always shopping and moving stuff around and going here and there. Yet she's on disability. My ex is on disability for bad knees and yet runs a lawn service. Every time his disability comes up for review he checks himself into the local mental hospital saying he's having a breakdown and needs his meds adjusted. I don't buy it for second. So if we're going to have a real conversation about cutting social programs let's have a real one. Let's not just single out the food stamp program. Because while it does need total revamping so do many other programs.

huskerbb · Guru

Same damn difference. I don't want my tax dollars going for ciggies.

huskerbb · Guru

Again, also, she directly stated EBT.

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

huskerbb wrote:
Again, also, she directly stated EBT.

husker, EBT HAS TWO ACCOUNTS ON IT! I'm trying to explain that to you. You don't seem to be getting it. You get an EBT card and if you qualify for both food stamps and a welfare check (which is basically money in lieu of child support) they are both loaded onto the same card. Therefore the card contains food stamps AND cash. It is perfectly legal to spend your EBT cash on cigarettes. I'm not saying it's MORALLY right. I'm just saying it's legally okay. Not against the law in the least.

huskerbb · Guru

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Again, also, she directly stated EBT.
husker, EBT HAS TWO ACCOUNTS ON IT! I'm trying to explain that to you. You don't seem to be getting it. You get an EBT card and if you qualify for both food stamps and a welfare check (which is basically money in lieu of child support) they are both loaded onto the same card. Therefore the card contains food stamps AND cash. It is perfectly legal to spend your EBT cash on cigarettes. I'm not saying it's MORALLY right. I'm just saying it's legally okay. Not against the law in the least.

I don't care.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

The point is that you should not be able to buy cigarettes or alcohol with ANY kind of welfare card - the fact that it is possible is what pisses people off. None. NADA. And your cash withdrawal ability should be almost non-existent. Nobody really NEEDS cash, anymore.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Yup.

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Lawyerlady wrote:
The point is that you should not be able to buy cigarettes or alcohol with ANY kind of welfare card - the fact that it is possible is what pisses people off. None. NADA. And your cash withdrawal ability should be almost non-existent. Nobody really NEEDS cash, anymore.

Again, you are angry at the wrong people. They are allowed cash so they can pay bills or buy diapers or whatever. The government needs to set up a system where they can pay their bills or whatever directly with the card. Or make them get a bank account. Or something. They system is broken. As long as people can legally play the system they will. It's the laws that need to be changed.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Here's what i propose. If you want welfare, you should have to go down and sign up for it week after week. Half of them would drop out for sheer laziness. It would be far cheaper for the govt to just give them all a check for $30K and say, here you go, now go figure out your housing, food, etc like the rest of the world. That would be far far cheaper than all this bullschit.

weltschmerz · Guru

About $59 billion is spent on traditional social welfare programs. $92 billion is spent on corporate subsidies. So, the government spent 50% more on corporate welfare than it did on food stamps and housing assistance in 2006.

Before we look at the details, a heartfelt plea from the Save the CEO’s Charitable Trust:

There’s so much suffering in the world. It can all get pretty overwhelming sometimes. Consider, for a moment the sorrow in the eyes of a CEO who’s just found out that his end-of-year bonus is only going to be a paltry $2.3 million.

“It felt like a slap in the face. Imagine what it would feel like just before Christmas to find out that you’re going to be forced to scrape by on your standard $8.4 million compensation package alone. Imagine what is was like to have to look into my daughter’s face and tell her that I couldn’t afford to both buy her a dollar sign shaped island and hire someone to chew her food from now on, too. To put her in that situation of having to choose… She’s only a child for God’s sake.”

It doesn’t have to be this way. Thanks to federal subsidies from taxpayers like you, CEO’s like G. Allen Andreas of Archer Daniels Midland was able to take home almost $14 million in executive compensation last year. But he’s one of the lucky ones. There are still corporations out there that actually have to provide goods and services to their consumers in order to survive. They need your help.

For just $93 billion a year the federal government is able to provide a better life for these CEO’s and their families. That’s less than the cost of 240 million cups of coffee a day. Won’t you help a needy corporation today?

thinkbynumbers.org/government-spending/corporate-welfare/corporate-welfare-statistics-vs-social-welfare-statistics/

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Corporations supply jobs, unlike welfare bums.

huskerbb · Guru

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
The point is that you should not be able to buy cigarettes or alcohol with ANY kind of welfare card - the fact that it is possible is what pisses people off. None. NADA. And your cash withdrawal ability should be almost non-existent. Nobody really NEEDS cash, anymore.
Again, you are angry at the wrong people. They are allowed cash so they can pay bills or buy diapers or whatever. The government needs to set up a system where they can pay their bills or whatever directly with the card. Or make them get a bank account. Or something. They system is broken. As long as people can legally play the system they will. It's the laws that need to be changed.

BS. We're angry at EXACTLY the right people.

The government set up a program with good intentions. It's people like this who abuse it. If "they will" play the system--then that's who the anger is and appropriately should be, directed at.

huskerbb · Guru

weltschmerz wrote:
About $59 billion is spent on traditional social welfare programs. $92 billion is spent on corporate subsidies. So, the government spent 50% more on corporate welfare than it did on food stamps and housing assistance in 2006.

Before we look at the details, a heartfelt plea from the Save the CEO’s Charitable Trust:

There’s so much suffering in the world. It can all get pretty overwhelming sometimes. Consider, for a moment the sorrow in the eyes of a CEO who’s just found out that his end-of-year bonus is only going to be a paltry $2.3 million.

“It felt like a slap in the face. Imagine what it would feel like just before Christmas to find out that you’re going to be forced to scrape by on your standard $8.4 million compensation package alone. Imagine what is was like to have to look into my daughter’s face and tell her that I couldn’t afford to both buy her a dollar sign shaped island and hire someone to chew her food from now on, too. To put her in that situation of having to choose… She’s only a child for God’s sake.”

It doesn’t have to be this way. Thanks to federal subsidies from taxpayers like you, CEO’s like G. Allen Andreas of Archer Daniels Midland was able to take home almost $14 million in executive compensation last year. But he’s one of the lucky ones. There are still corporations out there that actually have to provide goods and services to their consumers in order to survive. They need your help.

For just $93 billion a year the federal government is able to provide a better life for these CEO’s and their families. That’s less than the cost of 240 million cups of coffee a day. Won’t you help a needy corporation today?

thinkbynumbers.org/government-spending/corporate-welfare/corporate-welfare-statistics-vs-social-welfare-statistics/

Your numbers are waaaaayyyyyy off. More than SEVENTY billion is spent on food stamps ALONE. That doesn't even include other forms of welfare.

I know what to do_sometimes · Frozen Sucks!

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Corporations supply jobs, unlike welfare bums.

Corporate welfare is a misnomer in most cases. Tax breaks are given to encourage new business and job creation, helping the economy.

Some industries, such as the bogus "green" industry, have been given a ton of no interest, no asset backed loans or grants, many have become defunct and, yes, the owner's reaped large salaries in a lot of cases. That has to be stopped.

weltschmerz · Guru

I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Corporations supply jobs, unlike welfare bums.
Corporate welfare is a misnomer in most cases. Tax breaks are given to encourage new business and job creation, helping the economy.

Some industries, such as the bogus "green" industry, have been given a ton of no interest, no asset backed loans or grants, many have become defunct and, yes, the owner's reaped large salaries in a lot of cases. That has to be stopped.

Oh, you mean like Walmart, giving their employees work just short of full time, so they STILL HAVE TO GET ASSISTANCE with everything from food, housing, and healthcare? With your money?

Kind of like that?

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

I would rather give them assistance who are actually working. But, funny it's WALMART WALMART WALMART! You have Walmart Derangement Syndrome. lol

huskerbb · Guru

weltschmerz wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Corporations supply jobs, unlike welfare bums.
Corporate welfare is a misnomer in most cases. Tax breaks are given to encourage new business and job creation, helping the economy.

Some industries, such as the bogus "green" industry, have been given a ton of no interest, no asset backed loans or grants, many have become defunct and, yes, the owner's reaped large salaries in a lot of cases. That has to be stopped.
Oh, you mean like Walmart, giving their employees work just short of full time, so they STILL HAVE TO GET ASSISTANCE with everything from food, housing, and healthcare? With your money?
Kind of like that?

Um, no. No one is talking about Wal-Mart.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

It's something that needs to be tossed in to ramp up the hysteria! Bush did it! Sarah Palin! Walmart!!

weltschmerz · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Corporations supply jobs, unlike welfare bums.
Corporate welfare is a misnomer in most cases. Tax breaks are given to encourage new business and job creation, helping the economy.

Some industries, such as the bogus "green" industry, have been given a ton of no interest, no asset backed loans or grants, many have become defunct and, yes, the owner's reaped large salaries in a lot of cases. That has to be stopped.
Oh, you mean like Walmart, giving their employees work just short of full time, so they STILL HAVE TO GET ASSISTANCE with everything from food, housing, and healthcare? With your money?
Kind of like that?

Um, no. No one is talking about Wal-Mart.

I was, It's in the link I posted.

Wal-Mart. Always high subsidies. Always.

The same is true in all other industries, too. The government gives tons of favors to the largest corporations, increasing the significant advantage they already have over smaller competing businesses. If, in the court of public opinion, Wal-Mart has been tried and convicted for the murder of main street, mom-and-pop America, then the government could easily be found guilty as a willing accomplice. Wal-Mart receives hundreds of millions of dollars of subsidization by local governments throughout the country. These subsidies take the form of bribes by local politicians trying to convince Wal-Mart to come to their town with the dream of significant job creation. Of course, from that follows a larger tax base. For example, a distribution center in Macclenny, Florida received $9 million in government subsidies in the form of free land, government-funded recruitment and training of employees, targeted tax breaks, and housing subsidies for employees allowing them to be paid significantly lower wages. A study by Good Jobs First found that 244 Wal-Marts around the country had received over $1 billion in government favors.

huskerbb · Guru

welts, party of one

welts, party of one

weltschmerz · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
welts, party of one

welts, party of one

Got nothing else, huh?

Haters gonna hate, hate, hate.

I'm quoting yoiu, in case it didn't register.

huskerbb · Guru

weltschmerz wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
welts, party of one

welts, party of one
Got nothing else, huh?
Haters gonna hate, hate, hate.
I'm quoting yoiu, in case it didn't register.

Wal-Mart is IRRELEVANT to the discussion. You are the only one who is worried about Wal-Mart.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Well, obviously all the Walmarts in Canada are providing $200K wages.

I know what to do_sometimes · Frozen Sucks!

weltschmerz wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Corporations supply jobs, unlike welfare bums.
Corporate welfare is a misnomer in most cases. Tax breaks are given to encourage new business and job creation, helping the economy.

Some industries, such as the bogus "green" industry, have been given a ton of no interest, no asset backed loans or grants, many have become defunct and, yes, the owner's reaped large salaries in a lot of cases. That has to be stopped.
Oh, you mean like Walmart, giving their employees work just short of full time, so they STILL HAVE TO GET ASSISTANCE with everything from food, housing, and healthcare? With your money?
Kind of like that?

Um, no. No one is talking about Wal-Mart.
I was, It's in the link I posted.
Wal-Mart. Always high subsidies. Always.
The same is true in all other industries, too. The government gives tons of favors to the largest corporations, increasing the significant advantage they already have over smaller competing businesses. If, in the court of public opinion, Wal-Mart has been tried and convicted for the murder of main street, mom-and-pop America, then the government could easily be found guilty as a willing accomplice. Wal-Mart receives hundreds of millions of dollars of subsidization by local governments throughout the country. These subsidies take the form of bribes by local politicians trying to convince Wal-Mart to come to their town with the dream of significant job creation. Of course, from that follows a larger tax base. For example, a distribution center in Macclenny, Florida received $9 million in government subsidies in the form of free land, government-funded recruitment and training of employees, targeted tax breaks, and housing subsidies for employees allowing them to be paid significantly lower wages. A study by Good Jobs First found that 244 Wal-Marts around the country had received over $1 billion in government favors.

LOLLLLLLLLLLL, Walmart pays no less an hourly rate than most other retail stores, such as Macy's. Same amount for the floor worker until one is promoted. WTF is wrong with you? Do you really want to kill the brick and mortar stores? They are already on their way down due to on line shopping.. Walmart is just one of those successful corporations that people love to hate. If they are so bad, then why do so many towns and cities want them to build a store in their community? I know why. They pay real estate taxes on once undeveloped land that taxes were not paid on prior, provided 100's of jobs in the community, AND they pay for the development of a better road way system near the store location.