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Post Info TOPIC: Christian, Let My Transgender People Go! (When Bigotry Uses the Bathroom)
apple


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Christian, Let My Transgender People Go! (When Bigotry Uses the Bathroom)
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Some days you read the news and you wonder how we’ve managed to survive as a civilization for millions of years without blowing it all up.

Today is one of those days for me.

This week Charlotte’s City Council voted 7 to 4 to approve new legislation protecting the LGBTQ community. These measures would allow these folks to shop and use public transportation and go out to dinner without being discriminated against (you know, like real human beings). Similar legislation is pending in many other cities.

Part of the new ordinance allows all people to use the public restroom of the gender they identify as.

Cue the predictable sky-is-falling, hand wringing and chest beating from so many of my professed Christian brothers and sisters, who rushed to social media the next morning to tearfully lament the insidious danger now certain to be unleashed on the stalls and urinals of the Queen City.

The assertion is that women and children are now in new and grave danger; not from Transgender folks necessarily (though there certainly were many suggestions of exactly that) but by predatory straight guys, who these religious folks believe will use this legislation for their gain,claiming they are Transgender and/or dressing up in women’s clothing in order to easily enter the ladies’ room to commit acts of violence.

What in the hot and humid Hell are we talking about here?

This is the kind of Don Quixote-esque manufacturing of a non-existent enemy that American Christians specialize in, in order to mask the fact that they are woefully uniformed, propelled by religious-fueled fear, and that they frankly find all this public and personal plumbing talk—icky. Their ignorance of the complexities of what a Transgender person is, causes them to caricature those people in order to fit the desired Christian narrative they’ve lived in, often reducing Trans people to cross-dressing female impersonators. (Too much Bosom Buddies and not enough Public Television).

That this represents some new public bathroom security risk is simply amyth.

What world are these people living in anyway? Where are all these supposed conversations taking place between strange straight men and the moms of elementary school boys, where the guys talk openly about their gender identity to cultivate trust and then proceed to follow the child into the bathroom and assault them without the mother’s knowledge? What massive hypothetical rabbit trail are we running down where such a scenario unfolds?

Whatever coming danger the opponents of this legislation are imagining for women or children, is already present. If sick straight men (who are overwhelming our societal predators) want to sneak into restrooms they don’t need to pull a Tootsie and claim they’re Trans to do it. Guys already do vile things and they aren’t seeing this LGBTQ anti-discrimination legislation as some welcome boost for business.

Seriously, this is the reddest of herrings.

Others allege that malfeasant college dudes looking to cop a feel on campus will conveniently “identify as Transgender” to get themselves easy access to female students in the loo. Right.

Do these folks have any idea what openly Transgender people go through on a daily basis; the relentless taunting and bullying and physical violence they endure? Do they know the alarming rates of depression and self-harm and suicide among the Transgender population?

I’ll answer that: they don’t have a freakin’ clue.

Because if they did have an inkling or if had done any reading or educated themselves at all, they would know that no straight guy is going to attach that label to himself just to get some perceived advantage on deviant behavior. No heterosexual man in his right mind would willingly subject himself to the kind of horror that other heterosexual men subject the Transgender community to each day. This is another no-brainer.

But let’s put aside the Transgender community for a moment. Do you notice the common thread here? Do you see the pattern?

The clear and present threat that all these terrified Christians are really concerned about is straight guys behaving badly, and yet this is not the battle we are choosing to fight. As so very often, the Church is engaging in a convenient holy war of misdirection.

We’re punishing Transgender people who want to use public restrooms, because we don’t trust heterosexual men not to be predatory animals.

We’re diminishing the quality of life of the Trans community because so many straight guys can’t control themselves and they can’t be left alone with women and kids.

This is a problem.
It’s not the LGBTQ community’s problem.
It’s not the dreaded Gay Agenda.
This is straight, Christian America’s legendary sexual hypocrisy rearing its disgusting head again.

It is a symptom of the sickness of far too many heteronormative (often Christian) guys who have all the power and all the privilege and all the breaks, and yet are the ones most likely to sexually assault women and to molest children and to make public spaces unsafe. They are the boogeyman we should be warning people about.

I am so tired of Christians tripping over themselves to be outraged by stuff that simply isn’t real or that so pales in comparison to the dangers truly lurking out there, whenever those dangers hit too close to home. (It’s much easier to “focus on the family” when it’s someone else’s family.)

Rape, sexual assault, prostitution, and human trafficking are largely the sins of those who are protesting the loudest. The truth is, if straight Christian men stopped engaging in this stuff it would probably soon evaporate for lack of funding and lack of business.

Maybe we need to stop making the LGBTQ community the scapegoats for the failings of straight folk.
Maybe we need to focus on heterosexual men and figure out why they can’t behave like decent human beings.
Maybe we need to pray about that and protest about that and preach about that, Church.
Maybe some high-profile evangelists need to stop chasing the low-hanging fruit of bigotry and show some real moral courage and preach truth to their own jacked-up choirs.
Maybe some holier-than-thou Presidential candidates should speak directly and continually into the sins of their siblings instead of throwing round irresponsible rhetoric that actually gives religious people consent from God to discriminate.
Maybe we Christians should ask ourselves where the love and compassion of Jesus are in all of this, and just what kind of testimony we’re giving to the LGBTQ community and the watching world?

Transgender men and women shouldn’t have to hold their bladders every day because we can’t get our act together and because we aren’t willing to open up a book that isn’t the Bible or isn’t featured on FoxNews.

Maybe we need to take a good, hard, unflinching look at the straight guys in our midst and ask why they are so very broken—and allow Transgender folks pee in peace for God’s sake. 

Christian, let my people go!

http://johnpavlovitz.com/2016/02/24/christian-let-my-transgender-people-go-when-bigotry-uses-the-bathroom/



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huskerbb


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It's NOT discrimination to require people to use the restroom that corresponds to their actual gender.

 

EVERYONE is expected to do that--or they used to be.



-- Edited by huskerbb on Monday 16th of May 2016 01:58:31 PM

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Ohfour


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The NC bill undid all of this. Old news...

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When were they not allowed to?



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apple


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I posted this because I thought it might give some insight into the transgender fear that is out there right now.



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Lawyerlady


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apple wrote:

I posted this because I thought it might give some insight into the transgender fear that is out there right now.

 And yet, at the same time, it belittles any fear that's parents have over sexual deviants (not the transgenders).  There are news reports all the time of women and children attacked or assaulted in bathrooms and dressing rooms.  I will say this for you again - there are MORE registered sex offenders (ones that have been caught) than there are transgenders in our society.  Giving them easier access to do what they do is gross negligence.  

Furthermore, I consider even ONE child getting abused to be more important than making this a law.

 

And this is mental illness, and should be treated as such - 

Do they know the alarming rates of depression and self-harm and suicide among the Transgender population?

 

 

 



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LawyerLady

 

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lilyofcourse


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I have a better understanding than you think.



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just Czech


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Such a special victims group. They don't give a cRap about anyone other than themselves and their agenda. The perv's are moving right on in due to this special victims group leaving the door wide open

Guess what, they are all mentally ill. I lumped the perv's in with the trans.

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lilyofcourse wrote:

I have a better understanding than you think.

Doubtful. 



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apple


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Lawyerlady wrote:
apple wrote:

I posted this because I thought it might give some insight into the transgender fear that is out there right now.

 And yet, at the same time, it belittles any fear that's parents have over sexual deviants (not the transgenders).  There are news reports all the time of women and children attacked or assaulted in bathrooms and dressing rooms.  I will say this for you again - there are MORE registered sex offenders (ones that have been caught) than there are transgenders in our society.  Giving them easier access to do what they do is gross negligence.  

Furthermore, I consider even ONE child getting abused to be more important than making this a law.

 

And this is mental illness, and should be treated as such - 

Do they know the alarming rates of depression and self-harm and suicide among the Transgender population?

 

 

 

 Right.... putting the blame on transgenders for the crimes of the real sexual deviants. 

 



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Lawyerlady


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apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
apple wrote:

I posted this because I thought it might give some insight into the transgender fear that is out there right now.

 And yet, at the same time, it belittles any fear that's parents have over sexual deviants (not the transgenders).  There are news reports all the time of women and children attacked or assaulted in bathrooms and dressing rooms.  I will say this for you again - there are MORE registered sex offenders (ones that have been caught) than there are transgenders in our society.  Giving them easier access to do what they do is gross negligence.  

Furthermore, I consider even ONE child getting abused to be more important than making this a law.

 

And this is mental illness, and should be treated as such - 

Do they know the alarming rates of depression and self-harm and suicide among the Transgender population?

 

 

 

 Right.... putting the blame on transgenders for the crimes of the real sexual deviants. 

 

 No, it is not. 

 

They can have reasonable accommodation, and what that is will vary depending on the place.  Their own bathroom as an example.  But a policy or law that says anyone can use the bathroom of their choice at any time is flat -out ridiculous and ignores the privacy rights of all the rest of society.  



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apple


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Lawyerlady wrote:
apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
apple wrote:

I posted this because I thought it might give some insight into the transgender fear that is out there right now.

 And yet, at the same time, it belittles any fear that's parents have over sexual deviants (not the transgenders).  There are news reports all the time of women and children attacked or assaulted in bathrooms and dressing rooms.  I will say this for you again - there are MORE registered sex offenders (ones that have been caught) than there are transgenders in our society.  Giving them easier access to do what they do is gross negligence.  

Furthermore, I consider even ONE child getting abused to be more important than making this a law.

 

And this is mental illness, and should be treated as such - 

Do they know the alarming rates of depression and self-harm and suicide among the Transgender population?

 

 

 

 Right.... putting the blame on transgenders for the crimes of the real sexual deviants. 

 

 No, it is not. 

 

They can have reasonable accommodation, and what that is will vary depending on the place.  Their own bathroom as an example.  But a policy or law that says anyone can use the bathroom of their choice at any time is flat -out ridiculous and ignores the privacy rights of all the rest of society.  

 Yes it is, you yourself have said that allowing transgenders to go into the washroom they identify with "opens the door" for predators. 

Ergo, you wish to punish the transgenders for the crimes of the real perverts heterosexual men!



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huskerbb


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Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

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apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
apple wrote:

I posted this because I thought it might give some insight into the transgender fear that is out there right now.

 And yet, at the same time, it belittles any fear that's parents have over sexual deviants (not the transgenders).  There are news reports all the time of women and children attacked or assaulted in bathrooms and dressing rooms.  I will say this for you again - there are MORE registered sex offenders (ones that have been caught) than there are transgenders in our society.  Giving them easier access to do what they do is gross negligence.  

Furthermore, I consider even ONE child getting abused to be more important than making this a law.

 

And this is mental illness, and should be treated as such - 

Do they know the alarming rates of depression and self-harm and suicide among the Transgender population?

 

 

 

 Right.... putting the blame on transgenders for the crimes of the real sexual deviants. 

 

 No, it is not. 

 

They can have reasonable accommodation, and what that is will vary depending on the place.  Their own bathroom as an example.  But a policy or law that says anyone can use the bathroom of their choice at any time is flat -out ridiculous and ignores the privacy rights of all the rest of society.  

 Yes it is, you yourself have said that allowing transgenders to go into the washroom they identify with "opens the door" for predators. 

Ergo, you wish to punish the transgenders for the crimes of the real perverts heterosexual men!

 It's not a punishment.  Nobody cared if true transgenders were using the bathrooms.  Most of the time, people didn't even notice.  But, saying ANYONE can use the bathroom is going to far.  Everyone should have just kept their mouths shut and left well enough alone.  

 



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huskerbb wrote:

Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

 You are wrong. It's more complicated than that.

Brain scans prove it.

flan



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flan327


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apple wrote:

I posted this because I thought it might give some insight into the transgender fear that is out there right now.

 Yes, and the OP made several good points.

flan



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just Czech


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flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:

Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

 You are wrong. It's more complicated than that.

Brain scans prove it.

flan

Brain scans prove it is a mental illness. 



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just Czech wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:

Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

 You are wrong. It's more complicated than that.

Brain scans prove it.

flan

Brain scans prove it is a mental illness. 

Source, please. 



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Ohfour


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weltschmerz wrote:
just Czech wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:

Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

 You are wrong. It's more complicated than that.

Brain scans prove it.

flan

Brain scans prove it is a mental illness. 

Source, please. 

  Brain scans prove an abnormality.



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flan327


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Ooooh, let's all get brain scans!

flan

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Ohfour


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I wouldnt suggest that. You would be finally diagnosed. I dont know that you could take it.

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apple


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weltschmerz wrote:
just Czech wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:

Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

 You are wrong. It's more complicated than that.

Brain scans prove it.

flan

Brain scans prove it is a mental illness. 

Source, please. 

 Don't hold your breath.



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Tinydancer


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Brain scans are interpreted so I guess it proves nothing either way.

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huskerbb


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flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:

Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

 You are wrong. It's more complicated than that.

Brain scans prove it.

flan

 Bull****.  It might prove they are fvcked in the head.  



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weltschmerz


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huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:

Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

 You are wrong. It's more complicated than that.

Brain scans prove it.

flan

 Bull****.  It might prove they are fvcked in the head.  

"Fvcked in the head." 

Classy. And then people wonder why they kill themselves.



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FNW


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I think hormones could play a part in it, and how they affect the brain, too.

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Ohfour


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weltschmerz wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:

Gender is a biological, physical FACT. It is NOT an "identity".

 You are wrong. It's more complicated than that.

Brain scans prove it.

flan

 Bull****.  It might prove they are fvcked in the head.  

"Fvcked in the head." 

Classy. And then people wonder why they kill themselves.

 They should be getting help instead of wanting people to treat them as normal. They are not normal. And if they think they are, they are indeed fvcked in the head.



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weltschmerz


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Ignorance is not a virtue.

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flan327


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weltschmerz wrote:

Ignorance is not a virtue.

 But it is a way of life, apparently.

flan



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weltschmerz wrote:

Ignorance is not a virtue.

 If you think these people are normal, then you are ignorant.  Nothing about them is normal....



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So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

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Lawyerlady wrote:

So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

 Liberal logic at its finest!



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Ohfour


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Not only that, is was SO insulting that she has to ignore me now so I dont further hurt her feelings!

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flan327


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Ohfour wrote:

Not only that, is was SO insulting that she has to ignore me now so I dont further hurt her feelings!

 I would think you'd be proud of how nasty your posts can be.

flan



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flan327 wrote:
Ohfour wrote:

Not only that, is was SO insulting that she has to ignore me now so I dont further hurt her feelings!

 I would think you'd be proud of how nasty your posts can be.

flan

 How is calling out a lie nasty?



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lilyofcourse


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weltschmerz wrote:

Ignorance is not a virtue.

 Caught Obama's last speech, I see.



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apple


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Lawyerlady wrote:

So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

 Are you being obtuse? I can't tell sometimes. 

Go back and read the thread slowly and tell me if you can figure it out because your obviously missing something....

Actually, don't bother. I give up.

 

 

 



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Lawyerlady


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Oh, I figured it out. The Sisterhood of Perpetual Victimhood (which you seem to be the newest member - congrats) gets to be offended and get their panties in a wad about everything and anything, whether it is about them or not, but most especially about generalizations, and then they can't see when they do it themselves.

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weltschmerz


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apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:

So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

 Are you being obtuse? I can't tell sometimes. 

Go back and read the thread slowly and tell me if you can figure it out because your obviously missing something....

Actually, don't bother. I give up.

 

 

 

Don't you see? Even the mod gets in on the bashing, so that everyone who doesn't agree with them will leave.

They want a big ole lesbian love fest, apparently.



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apple wrote:

I posted this because I thought it might give some insight into the transgender fear that is out there right now.

 Oh yeah, transgender FEAR!  Time to create a new slur to hurl at people!  Racist, sexist, homophobe, climate denier, birther,  BruceCaitaphobe!



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weltschmerz wrote:
apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:

So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

 Are you being obtuse? I can't tell sometimes. 

Go back and read the thread slowly and tell me if you can figure it out because your obviously missing something....

Actually, don't bother. I give up.

 

 

 

Don't you see? Even the mod gets in on the bashing, so that everyone who doesn't agree with them will leave.

They want a big ole lesbian love fest, apparently.

 That's just what the view is.   A big ole lesbian lovefest.  Oh, they will bring a token conservative or moderate so they have someone to spew their venom and squirt their juices at!



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Ohfour


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Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:

So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

 Are you being obtuse? I can't tell sometimes. 

Go back and read the thread slowly and tell me if you can figure it out because your obviously missing something....

Actually, don't bother. I give up.

 

 

 

Don't you see? Even the mod gets in on the bashing, so that everyone who doesn't agree with them will leave.

They want a big ole lesbian love fest, apparently.

 That's just what the view is.   A big ole lesbian lovefest.  Oh, they will bring a token conservative or moderate so they have someone to spew their venom and squirt their juices at!

 She may be a mod, but she is still a poster. Does she not get to speak her mind because she's a mod? Start your own board if you don't like this one. Where Russian, French, Canadians stroke each other ad nauseam. We dont play that game....



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Lady Gaga Snerd


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Welts is under the impression that mods who are liberal and support her views aren't actually preaching to the choir. She participates in the board and LL can give her opinions. Wow. Funny how she wants people who sit down and shut up if they don't vomit up her views.

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Empyreal


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It should just come down to don't ask don't tell. Nobody is going to frisk you on your way in or out of there...

This is just some sick way of allowing weirdos to remove the perimeter between them an their victims.



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flan327


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Ohfour wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:

So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

 Are you being obtuse? I can't tell sometimes. 

Go back and read the thread slowly and tell me if you can figure it out because your obviously missing something....

Actually, don't bother. I give up.

 

 

 

Don't you see? Even the mod gets in on the bashing, so that everyone who doesn't agree with them will leave.

They want a big ole lesbian love fest, apparently.

 That's just what the view is.   A big ole lesbian lovefest.  Oh, they will bring a token conservative or moderate so they have someone to spew their venom and squirt their juices at!

 She may be a mod, but she is still a poster. Does she not get to speak her mind because she's a mod? Start your own board if you don't like this one. Where Russian, French, Canadians stroke each other ad nauseam. We dont play that game....

 Not when you can speak it for her, darlin'.

Part of the neat thing about a message board is getting to know different cultures & ways of life.

Maybe you can get Lily to post a definition of "xenophobia" for you.

flan



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Lawyerlady


On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

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flan327 wrote:
Ohfour wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:

So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

 Are you being obtuse? I can't tell sometimes. 

Go back and read the thread slowly and tell me if you can figure it out because your obviously missing something....

Actually, don't bother. I give up.

 

 

 

Don't you see? Even the mod gets in on the bashing, so that everyone who doesn't agree with them will leave.

They want a big ole lesbian love fest, apparently.

 That's just what the view is.   A big ole lesbian lovefest.  Oh, they will bring a token conservative or moderate so they have someone to spew their venom and squirt their juices at!

 She may be a mod, but she is still a poster. Does she not get to speak her mind because she's a mod? Start your own board if you don't like this one. Where Russian, French, Canadians stroke each other ad nauseam. We dont play that game....

 Not when you can speak it for her, darlin'.

Part of the neat thing about a message board is getting to know different cultures & ways of life.

Maybe you can get Lily to post a definition of "xenophobia" for you.

flan

 Excuse me????

 

I don't need anyone to speak for me.  I'm quite capable of speaking my mind. 

 

And Weltz's way of life and behavior is an insult to whatever culture she is part of.



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flan327


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I realize that, but I get chided for the same thing.

flan

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Lawyerlady


On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

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flan327 wrote:

I realize that, but I get chided for the same thing.

flan

 How did she speak FOR me?  She was responding to a comment ABOUT me, not a question to me. 

 

And weltz has a lot of nerve, she chooses to ignore me yet talk about me and question me as a mod?  I am a poster first, and can speak my mind as I choose.  If she doesn't like it, she is free to leave.  She is NOT free to question moderation decisions or throw my mod status in my face when she doesn't like what I post. 

 

 



-- Edited by Lawyerlady on Tuesday 17th of May 2016 06:40:49 AM

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LawyerLady

 

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Lady Gaga Snerd


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flan327 wrote:
Ohfour wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
apple wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:

So, let me get this straight. Saying The View is a liberal show watched by libs is somehow a personal insult to apple, but she can start a whole thread about Christians being bigots.

 Are you being obtuse? I can't tell sometimes. 

Go back and read the thread slowly and tell me if you can figure it out because your obviously missing something....

Actually, don't bother. I give up.

 

 

 

Don't you see? Even the mod gets in on the bashing, so that everyone who doesn't agree with them will leave.

They want a big ole lesbian love fest, apparently.

 That's just what the view is.   A big ole lesbian lovefest.  Oh, they will bring a token conservative or moderate so they have someone to spew their venom and squirt their juices at!

 She may be a mod, but she is still a poster. Does she not get to speak her mind because she's a mod? Start your own board if you don't like this one. Where Russian, French, Canadians stroke each other ad nauseam. We dont play that game....

 Not when you can speak it for her, darlin'.

Part of the neat thing about a message board is getting to know different cultures & ways of life.

Maybe you can get Lily to post a definition of "xenophobia" for you.

flan

 XenoPHOBE!  Oh yeah, forgot about that one, lol!!  



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Lawyerlady


On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

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I'm just trying to figure out apple's confusion. Did she not start this thread about how Christians are bigots?

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