TOTALLY GEEKED!

Lawyerlady wrote:

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To say that anyone having faith that only one religion is right is to call everyone with any religious faith arrogant.

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 I'm sorry that I don't agree.  As I said earlier, I don't believe having faith is arrogant.  

wild_blue wrote:

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lilyofcourse wrote:

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There are things I see other religions do that I am impressed with.

Even the Muslims. They pray 5 times a day. They stop whatever they are doing and take time to pray. That is something I could do more of. Real praying.

The JW's visit. They get out and they really take the witnessing and visiting to heart. Would you give up your Saturdays to go door to door to tell others about your faith? Would you do it every single Saturday?

There are other things that are done by the different beliefs that can be a lesson to us as well.

Could you imagine the explosion of Christianity if we would get serious in our daily prayers and really get out there and witness and be the Church, not just sit in one for a couple hours on Sunday and throw a 20 in the basket and call it good?

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I admire the women in the Russian Orthodox and Pentecostal churches who cover their hair for services. Also the Mennonites, who do it all the time. Frankly I just don't have that level of submission in me. Way too egalitarian. No one's gonna make me do something men don't have to do.

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I have never covered my hair for church. Well except for a fabulous Easter hat or two.

lilyofcourse wrote:

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I grew up in Pentecostal churches. Never had to cover my head.

My mom grew up in the Church of God of Union Assembly. They couldn't cut their hair. They couldn't wear make up and the girls and women could not wear anything but dresses or skirts. Had to dress modestly. Didn't go to the doctor unless it was something absolutely necessary. I mean life threatening or life changing.

The CGUA isn't as strict as it once was and don't hold to those anymore.

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Maybe not everyone does it, I don't know. I just had a coworker who was Pentecostal and she mentioned covering it in church. I didn't want to give her the 3rd degree about it.

I actually don't think there is anything wrong with anyone who wants to cover their head during church.
DH and I were reading scripture teachings about it two evenings ago. I can understand the basic premise. It doesn't say to cover your head while attending service, but if you are reading God's word for the service, yeah, I can see why it was required for both men and women to have their heads covered in reverence.
I'm sure if I went to church with a modest scarf over my hair, people would have a fit though.

Some would probably say I need to cover my face. 

WYSIWYG wrote:

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Once is a start. A "good first step", if you will. Like allowing Muslims into the National Cathedral.

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 No, it isn't.  It's disrespectful to practice your religion in another religion's place of worship. 

flan327 wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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WYSIWYG wrote:

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Once is a start. A "good first step", if you will. Like allowing Muslims into the National Cathedral.

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 No, it isn't.  It's disrespectful to practice your religion in another religion's place of worship. 

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 Why? It's just a building.

They were INVITED. They aren't sacrificing goats, husker...

flan

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Again, spoken by someone with no faith.  

flan327 wrote:

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Not YOUR faith, husker.

Big difference.

flan

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Not any, if any of your previous posts about being agnostic have any truth to them.   

flan327 wrote:

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lilyofcourse wrote:

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Sacrificing goats in old testament. So, at one time, that would have had a place in the Temple.

Praying to another god does not.

I understand they were invited and this is not the first time other Faith's have been invited there.

They should not have been invited. Not because of any other reason than they pray to a false god.

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 Good thing you aren't in charge.

flan

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I should be. I should be in charge of a lot of things.  

WYSIWYG wrote:

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"They should not have been invited. Not because of any other reason than they pray to a false god." - lilyofcourse

Says who? Their beliefs state that the Christian God is a false god. Who is right?

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 According to the Christian beliefs, they are praying to a false God, and this is a Christian church.  So they should not have been invited.

PotteryChick wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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WYSIWYG wrote:

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"They should not have been invited. Not because of any other reason than they pray to a false god." - lilyofcourse

Says who? Their beliefs state that the Christian God is a false god. Who is right?

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The Bible is right.   

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 Which bible?  There are hundreds.  

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 No.  There is ONE Holy Bible. 

flan327 wrote:

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Lawyerlady wrote:

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flan327 wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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WYSIWYG wrote:

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"They should not have been invited. Not because of any other reason than they pray to a false god." - lilyofcourse

Says who? Their beliefs state that the Christian God is a false god. Who is right?

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The Bible is right.   

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 In your opinion, dear man!

flan

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 And to him and his beliefs - that's the opinion that matters. 

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 To husker, it's a FACT.

flan

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 It's a fact to me, as well. 

PotteryChick wrote:

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Lawyerlady wrote:

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PotteryChick wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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WYSIWYG wrote:

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"They should not have been invited. Not because of any other reason than they pray to a false god." - lilyofcourse

Says who? Their beliefs state that the Christian God is a false god. Who is right?

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The Bible is right.   

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 Which bible?  There are hundreds.  

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 No.  There is ONE Holy Bible. 

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 Omgladiolas.  That is completely false and is a lazy answer to a provocative question.  

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flan

What's the difference between the Jewish concept of God and the Muslim concept of Allah? Both are worshiping one God.

THE MANY NAMES OF GOD

• Miscellaneous Documents

"Give thanks to Yahweh, call on his name..." Psalms 105:1a

In the Bible there are many different names given to the One True God.  The most frequently used names are YHWH, usually rendered as Yahweh (ca. 6,800 times); Elohim (ca. 2,600 times); Adonai (ca. 439 times); and El (ca. 238 times).  Most of the other names are combinations of these names like El Shaddai, El Eloah, and Yahweh Elohim.  The most commonly used names for God in the Hebrew and Protestant Bibles are Ha-Shem (meaning "the name" which is used in the modern Jewish Masoretic Text translations of the Tanach) and Jehovah (used in both Protestant and Jewish translations).  Both are names for God that only date back to the Middle Ages and are not found in the ancient texts of Sacred Scripture.

ADONAI:  The word adon, in Hebrew, is translated "lord."  God's name as Adonai is a form of the word "adon" with an "ai" ending.  Adonai is used about 439 times in the Bible and can be translated either as "Lord" or as "my Lord".   Biblical scholars and linguists, however, cannot agree as to the meaning of the "ai" suffix that has been added to the Hebrew word for "lord" (adon).  Some scholars have suggested it indicates a plural of majesty.  In most English translations this word is rendered as "Lord" with the first letter capitalized and the other letters lower case.  Those translations that have the word "Lord" in all capital letters, "LORD", are instead indicating God's covenant name YHWH (usually rendered "Yahweh").  The use of all capital letters denotes the difference between the use of Adonai and Yahweh.  (Only the NRSV translation confuses the issue by rendering Adonai as both "Lord" and "LORD").

EL and ELOHIM: The word El is used for God about 238 times while Elohim is used about 2,600 times.  In the Bible Elohim has two distinct meanings.  First it is a plural form (-im and -ot are the standard Hebrew plural endings) of the word "god" in the Hebrew and the Canaanite languages which is rendered "el" in the singular (when the word "el" is used for the One True God it is always capitalized = "El").  An example of the first meaning used in the plural form can be found in Deuteronomy 5:7: You shall have not other false gods [elohim] before me.   But the most common use of Elohim is its second distinct meaning when it is used as a personal name for God or when referring to God as the true God among false gods.  Thus it is used in Genesis 1:1: In the beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth ..., and also in Joshua 24:19: You cannot worship Yahweh for He is a holy god [elohim]....  There is no explanation why the plural form is used for the One True God (as it is in Genesis 1:1).  However, scholars from the times of the Fathers of the Church have suggested that the plural form suggests the mystery of the Trinity which was hidden in the Old Testament to be revealed in the New.

YHWH:  The four Hebrew consonants that comprise YHWH are given in Scripture as God's holy Covenant name, and it is this form of His name that is the most frequently used in the Bible (about 6,800 times).  These four Hebrew characters, YHWH = yad, hay, vav (v in Hebrew can also be rendered w in English), and hay have been called the "Tetragrammaton" or "tetragram", meaning "the four letter word."  Biblical scholars do not know how YHWH was originally pronounced because its original pronunciation, which was part of the sacred Oral Tradition of the Jews, was lost when the Temple in Jerusalem was destroyed in 70AD.  Throughout history, God's Old Covenant people treated God's name with great reverence, declaring it too holy to be spoken aloud.  Speaking God's divine covenant name was restricted to the priests worshipping in God's Temple in Jerusalem, and so with the destruction of the Temple His holy covenant name was no longer spoken and the correct pronunciation of the name was lost.  The rendering of YHWH as "Yahweh" is a modern conjecture (first suggested in the 16^th century by biblical scholar Gilbert Genebrard, professor of Hebrew at the College Royal in Paris) but which has been accepted by biblical scholars today as the most likely rendering.  You will find this rendering in the Catholic New Jerusalem Bible translation.  In other translations, following what became the Jewish custom, YHWH is rendered as LORD (for example in the Catholic Revised Standard and New American Bible translations as well as in most Protestant Bible translations).  This became a custom from the time of the 3^rd century BC when the ancient Jewish scholars translated the Hebrew Bible (Old Testament) into the Greek translation known as the Septuagint.  They replaced the Sacred Name YHWH with "ho Kyrios" or "the Lord." In the modern Jewish Tanach YHWH is rendered as Hashem (or ha-Shem, meaning in Hebrew, "the name") or as Adoshem, which is a contraction of Adonai and ha-Shem.

But what does the Tetragrammaton YHWH mean?  Biblical scholars have been arguing about the meaning of YHWH for centuries.  Since biblical names generally have a discernible meaning, scholars have believed that YHWH can be reasonably translated.  Based on etymology and context most scholars have agreed that YHWH is an archaic form of the verb "to be" (in Hebrew hawah) and should be translated "I am who I am or I will be who I will be." This meaning contextually fits the passages in Exodus 3:13-15a:  Moses then said to God [Elohim], 'Look, if I go to the Israelites and say to me, "What is his name?" what am I to tell them?'  God [Elohim] said to Moses, 'I am [YHWH] he who is.'  And he said, 'This is what you are to say to the Israelites I am [YHWH] has sent me to you...', which agrees withExodus 3:6: I am the God of your ancestors ...,  and Jesus' "I AM" statements in the fourth Gospel i.e.: In all truth I tell you, before Abraham ever was, I AM (John 8:58).

JEHOVAH:  The Biblical reference to God as Yehova (Jehova), spelled out with Hebrew characters, first appeared in c. 800AD.  At that time Jewish scholars (called the Masorites) translated the Greek translation of the (Old Testament) Bible back into Hebrew and added vowel points to the Hebrew language, which had originally only been written with consonants.  Since that time, Hebrew Bible manuscripts have inserted the vowels from the Hebrew word "Adonai" (Lord) within the Tetragrammaton ("the four letters), YHWH, as a reminder that readers should say "Adonai" instead of the sacred name which Jews believe must not be spoken.  The pronunciation of "Jehovah" was unknown until 1520 AD when a biblical scholar named Galatians introduced it.  This pronunciation was contested by other scholars as being against grammatical and historical propriety.  However, when Protestant scholars began their vernacular translations (into their common languages) of the Old Testament using the Jewish Masoretic translations, they also mixed the four consonants of YHWH (JHWH in German) with the vowels of Adonai in the mistaken belief that this was the correct pronunciation of the Sacred Name, and from then on, YHWH appeared in Protestant Biblical texts as "Jehovah".  This rendering is most frequently used in the King James Version translations as in, Let them be put to shame, and perish: That men may know that thou, whose name alone is Jehovah, art the most high over all the earth (Psalms 83:18).  Modern scholars do not recognize this form as a legitimate name for the Hebrew God and dismiss it as a misreading or mispronunciation. 

Names for God found in Sacred Scripture
and some of the passages in which these names are found:

All Scripture quotations are from the New Jerusalem Bible (NJB) unless otherwise noted as from the New American Bible (NAB).

• Elohim = "God" (plural) as in the Creator: In the beginning God (Elohim) created the heaven and the earth (Genesis 1:1).
  
  
• El Elyon = "God (singular) Most High": And Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine; now he was a priest of [El Elyon] God the Most High.  And He blessed him and said, ''blessed be Abram of God Most High, possessor of heaven and earth; and blessed be God Most High, who has delivered your enemies into your hand (Genesis 14:18-20).
  
  
• El Roi = "God Who Sees": Then she called the name of the LORD who spoke to her, 'You are a [El Roi] God who sees'; for she said, 'Have I even remained alive here after seeing Him?'  Therefore the well was called Beer-lahai-roi [well of the living one who sees me] (Genesis 16:13-14).
  
  
• El Shaddai = "God Almighty" or "God the All-Sufficient One"; the etymology is so ancient that Biblical scholars do not agree on the meaning of this name: I AM El Shaddai.  Live in my presence, be perfect, and I shall grant a covenant between myself and you, and make you very numerous.  And Abram bowed to the ground (Genesis 17:2-3).
  
  
• Yahweh = found in Scripture as the consonants YHWH, known as the "Tetragramaton" is God's holy Covenant name.  The letters  form a word or words from the verb "to be" and most scholars translate it as "I AM who I AM" or "I will be who I will be", or "the Self-Existent One: Moses said to God, 'Look, if I go to the Israelites and say to them, The God of your ancestors has sent me to you, and they say to me, 'What is His name?' what am I to tell them?'  God said to Moses, 'I AM He who is.  Tell them that I AM who I am sent you (Exodus 3:13-14).
  
  
• Adonai = "Lord" (Note: LORD, all in capital letters is a substitution out of reverence for God's covenant name "Yahweh"): Then Moses said to the LORD, 'Please Lord, I have never been eloquent, neither recently nor in time past, nor since you have spoken to  your servant; for I am slow of speech and slow of tongue. And the LORD said to him, 'Who has made men's mouth?  Or who make him dumb or deaf, or seeing or blind?  Is it not I, the LORD?' (Exodus 4:10-12, NAB).
  
  
• Yahweh-jireh = "Yahweh will provide" or "I AM will provide": But the angel of the LORD called to him from heaven and said, 'Abraham, Abraham!'  And he said, 'Here I am.'  And he said, 'Do not stretch out your hand against the lad, and do nothing to him; for now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your son, your only son, form Me.' Then Abraham raised his eyes and looked, and behind him he saw a ram caught up in the thicket by his horns; and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the place of his son.  And Abraham called the name of that place [Yahweh jireh] The LORD will provide, as it is said to this day: On the Mountain Yahweh provides (Genesis 22:11-14).
  
  
• Yahweh-rapha = "Yahweh who heals": If you will give earnest heed to the voice of Yahweh your God and do what He regards as right, if you pay attention to His commandments and keep all His laws, I shall never inflict on you any of the diseases that  I inflicted on the Egyptians, for I am Yahweh your Healer [Yahweh rapha] (Exodus 15:26).
  
  
• Yahweh–nissi = "Yahweh My Banner": (after willing a battle with God's assistance ) Moses built an altar, and named it Yahweh is My Banner [Yahweh-nissi] ...(Exodus 17:16).
  
  
• Yahweh-mekoddishkem = "Yahweh Who Sanctifies You": And Yahweh spoke to Moses, saying, 'But as for you, speak to the sons of Israel, saying, "You shall surely observe My Sabbaths; for this is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am Yahweh who sanctifies you [Yahweh-mekoddishkem]...(Exodus 31:12).
  
  
• Yahweh-shalom = "Yahweh is Peace": He said, 'Alas, my Lord, Yahweh!  Now I have seen the Angel of Yahweh face to face    ' Yahweh answered, 'Peace be with you; have no fear; you will not die.'  Gideon built an altar there to Yahweh and called it Yahweh is peace [Yahweh-shalom] (Judges 6:22-24).
  
  
• Yahweh-sabaoth = "Yahweh of Hosts" (the "hosts" are the army of angels who serve God): Who is He, this king of glory?  Yahweh of Hosts [Yahweh-saboath], He is the king of glory (Psalm 46:7, NJB); The LORD of Hosts [Yahweh-sabaoth] is with us; the God of Jacob is our stronghold (Psalms 22:10, NAB).  
  
  
• Yahweh-raah = "Yahweh My Shepherd": The LORD [Yahweh raah] is my shepherd; I shall not want ...(Psalms 23:1, NAB).
  
  
• Yahweh-tsidkenu = "Yahweh Our Saving Justice": Look, the days are coming, Yahweh declares, when I shall rise an upright Branch for David; He will reign as king and be wise, doing what is just and upright in the country.  In his days Judah will triumph and Israel live in safety, and this is the name He will be called  Yahweh-our-saving-justice [Yahweh-tsidkenu] (Jeremiah 23:5-6).
  
  

• The Names of Jesus in the Book of Revelation:

  • 1:5             The First-born from the dead
  • 1:5             The highest of earthly kings
  • 1:8             The Alpha and Omega (also 22:13)
  • 1:8             Lord God
  • 1:8             The Almighty
  • 1:13           Son of Man
  • 1:17           The First and the Last   (also 1:11;21:6;22:13)
  • 1:18           The Living One
  • 2:18           Son of God
  • 3:14           Witness (also "faithful witness" in 1:5)
  • 4:11           Creator
  • 5:5             Lion of the Tribe of Judah
  • 5:5             Root of David
  • 5:6             The Lamb
  • 7:17           The Shepherd
  • 12:10         Christ (Anointed)
  • 19:11         Faithful and True
  • 19:13         Word of God
  • 19:16         King of Kings
  • 19:16         Lord of Lords

  What ever word you use when you call upon the name of God, remember to call in reverence and in love for the word that expresses the essence of God in His most intimate relationship with you is LOVE, for God is love (1 John 4:16c).

  We are waiting for Yahweh;
  He is our help and our shield,
  For in Him our heart rejoices,
  In His holy name we trust.
  Yahweh, let your faithful love rest on us.
  As our hope has rested in you.
  Psalms 33:20-22

  Michal Hunt, Copyright © 2003 Agape Bible Study. Permissions All Rights Reserved.

  • Miscellaneous Documents

  REFERENCES

  1. The Jewish Book of Why, Alfred J. Kolatch, Jonathan David Publishers, Inc. 1995

  2. Bible Review (August 2003): "Why God has so Many Names" by Bernhard Lang (Old Testament and religious studies, University of St. Andrews, Scotland & Professor of Catholic Theology, University of Paderborn, Germany).

  3. Dictionary of the Bible, John L McKenzie, editor (Simon & Schuster, 1995).

  4. Vincent's Word Studies in the New Testament vol. II, Martin R. Vincent, D.D., Union Theological Seminary, (Hendrickson Publishers).

  5. The Brown-Driver-Briggs Hebrew and English Lexicon, R. Brown, S. Driver, and C

Lawyerlady wrote:

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Ohfour wrote:

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ed11563 wrote:

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What's the difference between the Jewish concept of God and the Muslim concept of Allah? Both are worshiping one God.

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 Totally different gods.  Neither of which are valid.

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 Actually, the Jewish God is the God of the Old Testament.  He is just not a Trinity. 

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 This is true.  Mea culpa...