TOTALLY GEEKED!

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Boy, 12, kills himself after 'he was bullied for being the only male cheerleader

Tinydancer · Guru

That is so sad. It amazes me just how cruel children can be.

Lexxy · My dog name is Sasha, too!

So terribly sad. I wish these kids would speak up to parents or friends before ending it all. At the moment schools seems like everything but as adults looking back we all know it was a drop in the bucket of life.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

People just need to learn to STFU. If it isn't YOUR business, it isn't YOUR business. Time to teach our kids more about minding their OWN business and not someone else's.

Fort Worth Mom · Mod/Penguin lover/Princess!

Lexxy wrote:
So terribly sad. I wish these kids would speak up to parents or friends before ending it all. At the moment schools seems like everything but as adults looking back we all know it was a drop in the bucket of life.

That is so true, Lexxy.

This poor boy couldn't see it. Very sad. cry

TrudyML · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
People just need to learn to STFU. If it isn't YOUR business, it isn't YOUR business. Time to teach our kids more about minding their OWN business and not someone else's.

So true!

Ohfour · Hooker

Fort Worth Mom wrote:
Lexxy wrote:
So terribly sad. I wish these kids would speak up to parents or friends before ending it all. At the moment schools seems like everything but as adults looking back we all know it was a drop in the bucket of life.
That is so true, Lexxy.
This poor boy couldn't see it. Very sad.

A friend of mine killed himself when we were in high school. I remember the preacher saying something along the lines of:

Teenage years are hard when you are there. People look back fondly and don't remember the angst years...the depression...the bullying...

But if you know a teenager is struggling, DO NOT tell them, "Buck up, these are the best years of your life!". Because at that moment, they are in a very dark place. And if they think that this moment is as good as it's ever going to get, there's no wonder the suicide rate is so high.

I have always remembered that and thought about it often. I think its excellent advice...

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

It looks like the parents were aware of the problem & alerted the school.

In his pictures, he looks so full of joy...

flan

Lexxy · My dog name is Sasha, too!

Ohfour wrote:
Fort Worth Mom wrote:
Lexxy wrote:
So terribly sad. I wish these kids would speak up to parents or friends before ending it all. At the moment schools seems like everything but as adults looking back we all know it was a drop in the bucket of life.
That is so true, Lexxy.
This poor boy couldn't see it. Very sad.
A friend of mine killed himself when we were in high school. I remember the preacher saying something along the lines of:
Teenage years are hard when you are there. People look back fondly and don't remember the angst years...the depression...the bullying...
But if you know a teenager is struggling, DO NOT tell them, "Buck up, these are the best years of your life!". Because at that moment, they are in a very dark place. And if they think that this moment is as good as it's ever going to get, there's no wonder the suicide rate is so high.

I have always remembered that and thought about it often. I think its excellent advice...

Your post made me think of a Brad Paisley song where he wants to write a letter to his teen self. He says these are nowhere near the best years of your life.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

VOR used to always say "Not my Circus, not my Monkeys". And, I think that is absolutely spot on. Why do we feel the need to comment or stick our noses in what someone else is doing? If we spent more time teaching people that, then maybe there would be less bullying.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
VOR used to always say "Not my Circus, not my Monkeys". And, I think that is absolutely spot on. Why do we feel the need to comment or stick our noses in what someone else is doing? If we spent more time teaching people that, then maybe there would be less bullying.

The boy was probably popular with the girls, so the other boys started mocking him? I wish I had the answer!

flan

Lexxy · My dog name is Sasha, too!

flan327 wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
VOR used to always say "Not my Circus, not my Monkeys". And, I think that is absolutely spot on. Why do we feel the need to comment or stick our noses in what someone else is doing? If we spent more time teaching people that, then maybe there would be less bullying.
The boy was probably popular with the girls, so the other boys started mocking him? I wish I had the answer!
flan

I was thinking that he got to talk to all the cheerleaders & be friends with some of them & it made some other boys jealous.

Lindley · Guru

Poor kid :(((

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

This is very sad, and he looks so happy in the pictures. I'm a little taken aback by the statement that the bullies "have learned a lesson". What, it took death?

On the other hand, and this will likely not be popular, but WTH were those parents thinking? Do they not remember school and how mean kids can be? Did they really think having their son be the only male cheerleader was NOT going to cause teasing? Yeah, yeah, kids should be able to do what they want and not be bullied - I AGREE. But, the idealistic idea of what life and school should be like is so far from reality and ignoring reality results in hurt feelings, bullying and a sucky school experience. There are a few things I'm not going to let my kid do - dress like Erkle, wear a pocket protector, or shave off her eyebrows. Kids are mean. It's an unfortunate part of growing up. But, geez louise, try to help your kid make wise decisions that don't make them a target.

Tinydancer · Guru

Sometimes they're a target for no reason at all. Bullying in school has yet to be dealt with in any constructive way.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Well, that really is not true. Schools do all kinds of things to address the bullying. However, part of the problem is that we solely focus on the bullies. That isn't the answer. The real answer is to teach kids that words of some bully should not be given more weight and importance in their lives than the words of people who love them. Kids that kill themselves are saying the Bully is Right. That is the true tragedy. That the words of some idiot somehow are more important to them than their mom and dad saying "I love you".
Yes, of course we need to address the bullies head on. And, schools do. But, you are never going to stop it. There are infinite ways to very subtlely bully people from a glance to a double entendre, etc.

Tinydancer · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Well, that really is not true. Schools do all kinds of things to address the bullying. However, part of the problem is that we solely focus on the bullies. That isn't the answer. The real answer is to teach kids that words of some bully should not be given more weight and importance in their lives than the words of people who love them. Kids that kill themselves are saying the Bully is Right. That is the true tragedy. That the words of some idiot somehow are more important to them than their mom and dad saying "I love you".
Yes, of course we need to address the bullies head on. And, schools do. But, you are never going to stop it. There are infinite ways to very subtlely bully people from a glance to a double entendre, etc.

Absolutely not true. If that were the case the schools would keep the bullies away. Instead it's always the bullied one that ends up having to leave the school.

Sure, because kids this age are emotionally mature enough to see it that way...lol If someone is hurting this bad they're not thinking rationally. You keep saying that all it takes is mom and dad telling them how much they're loved. So all kids who kill themselves weren't told this by their parents? If that's all it took we'd have a heck of a lot fewer suicides.

FNW · Guru

Lawyerlady wrote:
This is very sad, and he looks so happy in the pictures. I'm a little taken aback by the statement that the bullies "have learned a lesson". What, it took death?

On the other hand, and this will likely not be popular, but WTH were those parents thinking? Do they not remember school and how mean kids can be? Did they really think having their son be the only male cheerleader was NOT going to cause teasing? Yeah, yeah, kids should be able to do what they want and not be bullied - I AGREE. But, the idealistic idea of what life and school should be like is so far from reality and ignoring reality results in hurt feelings, bullying and a sucky school experience. There are a few things I'm not going to let my kid do - dress like Erkle, wear a pocket protector, or shave off her eyebrows. Kids are mean. It's an unfortunate part of growing up. But, geez louise, try to help your kid make wise decisions that don't make them a target.

My thoughts exactly.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

FNW wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
This is very sad, and he looks so happy in the pictures. I'm a little taken aback by the statement that the bullies "have learned a lesson". What, it took death?

On the other hand, and this will likely not be popular, but WTH were those parents thinking? Do they not remember school and how mean kids can be? Did they really think having their son be the only male cheerleader was NOT going to cause teasing? Yeah, yeah, kids should be able to do what they want and not be bullied - I AGREE. But, the idealistic idea of what life and school should be like is so far from reality and ignoring reality results in hurt feelings, bullying and a sucky school experience. There are a few things I'm not going to let my kid do - dress like Erkle, wear a pocket protector, or shave off her eyebrows. Kids are mean. It's an unfortunate part of growing up. But, geez louise, try to help your kid make wise decisions that don't make them a target.
My thoughts exactly.

I understand what you guys are saying, but it still depresses me.

flan

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Tinydancer wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Well, that really is not true. Schools do all kinds of things to address the bullying. However, part of the problem is that we solely focus on the bullies. That isn't the answer. The real answer is to teach kids that words of some bully should not be given more weight and importance in their lives than the words of people who love them. Kids that kill themselves are saying the Bully is Right. That is the true tragedy. That the words of some idiot somehow are more important to them than their mom and dad saying "I love you".
Yes, of course we need to address the bullies head on. And, schools do. But, you are never going to stop it. There are infinite ways to very subtlely bully people from a glance to a double entendre, etc.
Absolutely not true. If that were the case the schools would keep the bullies away. Instead it's always the bullied one that ends up having to leave the school.
Sure, because kids this age are emotionally mature enough to see it that way...lol If someone is hurting this bad they're not thinking rationally. You keep saying that all it takes is mom and dad telling them how much they're loved. So all kids who kill themselves weren't told this by their parents? If that's all it took we'd have a heck of a lot fewer suicides.

Don't put words in my mouth. I didnt' say they were emotionally mature enough to see it that way. But, you have to lay the ground work for an emotionally healthy adult. How many adults are STILL going around reliving their High School days and can't put it behind them? So, we absolutely need to teach our children to be independent and resilient. And, if you live under the presumption that the only way kids can survive is to eliminate all bullying, the reality is that isn't going to happen. And, not every behavior is bullying. YOu also need to teach your kids that other kids are not REQUIRED to like them, be their friend or support them. And, just because someone is a naysayer towards you does not mean you have to give their words POWER over you.

Tinydancer · Guru

I'm sure almost all of the parents said all those things to their kid yet the kid did it anyway. Words do have power whether you want to admit it or not. Yes, in a perfect world little Bobby would know he shouldn't let them decide how he feels about himself. It seem the consequences for being a bully are not tough enough. I have heard of way too many times where practically nothing was done and then when this stuff happens they can't understand how it happened. This kids parents complained to the school and yet those boys were allowed to continue to harass him. It's up to the adults to protect these kids. It should not be on the kid to figure out how to make it stop.

Tinydancer · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Tinydancer wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Well, that really is not true. Schools do all kinds of things to address the bullying. However, part of the problem is that we solely focus on the bullies. That isn't the answer. The real answer is to teach kids that words of some bully should not be given more weight and importance in their lives than the words of people who love them. Kids that kill themselves are saying the Bully is Right. That is the true tragedy. That the words of some idiot somehow are more important to them than their mom and dad saying "I love you".
Yes, of course we need to address the bullies head on. And, schools do. But, you are never going to stop it. There are infinite ways to very subtlely bully people from a glance to a double entendre, etc.
Absolutely not true. If that were the case the schools would keep the bullies away. Instead it's always the bullied one that ends up having to leave the school.
Sure, because kids this age are emotionally mature enough to see it that way...lol If someone is hurting this bad they're not thinking rationally. You keep saying that all it takes is mom and dad telling them how much they're loved. So all kids who kill themselves weren't told this by their parents? If that's all it took we'd have a heck of a lot fewer suicides.
Don't put words in my mouth. I didnt' say they were emotionally mature enough to see it that way. But, you have to lay the ground work for an emotionally healthy adult. How many adults are STILL going around reliving their High School days and can't put it behind them? So, we absolutely need to teach our children to be independent and resilient. And, if you live under the presumption that the only way kids can survive is to eliminate all bullying, the reality is that isn't going to happen. And, not every behavior is bullying. YOu also need to teach your kids that other kids are not REQUIRED to like them, be their friend or support them. And, just because someone is a naysayer towards you does not mean you have to give their words POWER over you.

I didn't put words in your mouth. You said "The real answer is to teach kids that words of some bully should not be given more weight and importance in their lives than the words of people who love them." This indicates to me that you think these kids are emotionally mature enough to think like an adult would about the situation. I think in a perfect world that would happen. Unfortunately the world is not perfect or they wouldn't be bullying at all. You are correct that not everything that's called bullying is actually bullying but that doesn't mean we dismiss it when it really does happen.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

""This indicates to me that you think these kids are emotionally mature enough to think like an adult would about the situation. ""

Um no I did NOT say that. You are reading INTO what I said . That is NOT what I said whatsoever.

Tinydancer · Guru

Ok. It's not what you said what's so ever...lol. Then please explain because it seems to me you think these kids should just be able to deal because mom and dad said I love you enough and told them not to believe the bullies. Kids do not think like that and saying that is a solution pretty much puts it right back on the kid.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Again you completely misread. It is a multi pronged approach. We need to address the bullies by teachers , admin , parents etc. We need to teach resilience. We need to teach kids how to deal with it. Not sure how that is controversial in your mind.

huskerbb · Guru

Tinydancer wrote:
Ok. It's not what you said what's so ever...lol. Then please explain because it seems to me you think these kids should just be able to deal because mom and dad said I love you enough and told them not to believe the bullies. Kids do not think like that and saying that is a solution pretty much puts it right back on the kid.

Sorry--but it is largely on the kid. You can't change the world to accommodate you. You can't change the world to accommodate your kid.

If you want to march to the beat of your own drummer--great--but you better have the mental fortitude and resilience to deal with that, and if that is your kid, you'd better be teaching them that.

If you are teaching your kid that they can do whatever they want to--and everyone will react positively to it and things will all be great, then you are doing your child a great disservice.

Bullies are not going away--and there is only so much that can be done to reign in that type of behavior, especially with the omnipresent social media. The school can only control what happen during school--and even that is difficult.

No one can really control what happens online or on cell phones.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Well said husker.

Tinydancer · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Again you completely misread. It is a multi pronged approach. We need to address the bullies by teachers , admin , parents etc. We need to teach resilience. We need to teach kids how to deal with it. Not sure how that is controversial in your mind.

Not contriversial at all once you added all the rest. Nice come back LGS. You never mentioned all that other stuff before.

Tinydancer · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
Tinydancer wrote:
Ok. It's not what you said what's so ever...lol. Then please explain because it seems to me you think these kids should just be able to deal because mom and dad said I love you enough and told them not to believe the bullies. Kids do not think like that and saying that is a solution pretty much puts it right back on the kid.
Sorry--but it is largely on the kid. You can't change the world to accommodate you. You can't change the world to accommodate your kid.
If you want to march to the beat of your own drummer--great--but you better have the mental fortitude and resilience to deal with that, and if that is your kid, you'd better be teaching them that.

If you are teaching your kid that they can do whatever they want to--and everyone will react positively to it and things will all be great, then you are doing your child a great disservice.
Bullies are not going away--and there is only so much that can be done to reign in that type of behavior, especially with the omnipresent social media. The school can only control what happen during school--and even that is difficult.
No one can really control what happens online or on cell phones.

I'm glad you're not my dad. My dad would be on my side. Not making excuses for the damn bully. Some kids are bullied for things they have no control over. So what do they do then. Just take it like a man and the hell with dealing with the damn bullies. I never said anything about cyber bulling. The answer to that is don't go online. I'm not sure what you want some kid with a lisp to do about the freaking bully who makes his life hell while you tell him to man up and LGS tells him he's loved...lol. That sure seems to be working so well.

Truth-or-Consequences · Newbie

Lexxy wrote:
flan327 wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
VOR used to always say "Not my Circus, not my Monkeys". And, I think that is absolutely spot on. Why do we feel the need to comment or stick our noses in what someone else is doing? If we spent more time teaching people that, then maybe there would be less bullying.
The boy was probably popular with the girls, so the other boys started mocking him? I wish I had the answer!
flan
I was thinking that he got to talk to all the cheerleaders & be friends with some of them & it made some other boys jealous.

There's probably a lot of truth in that thought. Whether the boy was getting anywhere with the other cheerleaders or not, the "outside looking in" boys didn't know that, and I agree that the bullying could have been... at least in part... due to that jealousy.

Truth-or-Consequences · Newbie

huskerbb wrote:
Tinydancer wrote:
Ok. It's not what you said what's so ever...lol. Then please explain because it seems to me you think these kids should just be able to deal because mom and dad said I love you enough and told them not to believe the bullies. Kids do not think like that and saying that is a solution pretty much puts it right back on the kid.
Sorry--but it is largely on the kid. You can't change the world to accommodate you. You can't change the world to accommodate your kid.
If you want to march to the beat of your own drummer--great--but you better have the mental fortitude and resilience to deal with that, and if that is your kid, you'd better be teaching them that.

If you are teaching your kid that they can do whatever they want to--and everyone will react positively to it and things will all be great, then you are doing your child a great disservice.
Bullies are not going away--and there is only so much that can be done to reign in that type of behavior, especially with the omnipresent social media. The school can only control what happen during school--and even that is difficult.
No one can really control what happens online or on cell phones.

Well said. I agree 100%

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

It's sad. This boy did some cheers on some Saturdays or whatever for some games. To turn that into something that is such a big deal resulting in a child's death is just pathetic.

Tinydancer · Guru

No one can control what happens? Really? So we send our kids to school for eight hours a day and just throw our hands up about what's allowed to happen? Spoken like a person who allows this to happen because of course boys will be boys and girls will be girls and why do anything at all and you'll never stop all bullying. How about we stop the blatant stuff or is that too much to ask?

In answer to Husker. Not LGS.

-- Edited by Tinydancer on Saturday 6th of December 2014 10:50:25 PM

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Why dont you tell us the answer since you seem to know? Lets hear it in specifics and details.

Tinydancer · Guru

Harsher punishment for the actual perpetrators. Funny how I hear about how the victim always has to change schools or be home schooled. How many bullies have actually been forced out of school? Let's coddle these bullies while we pretend that it just wouldn't happen if the kid would just man up...

-- Edited by Tinydancer on Saturday 6th of December 2014 10:55:35 PM

Truth-or-Consequences · Newbie

No one can control what happens, only limit where it happens as much as possible.

If schools make it 100% impossible on school grounds (not that that's likely... but... work with me here), the bullying will just happen on the way home from school or on the way too school. or in the McDonald's the first time they see the person they want to bully there.

Tinydancer · Guru

So you're answer is to just keep doing what we're doing? How's that working for you?

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

What punishment tiny? If a kid calls another a name how harsh should the punishment be? Details. If u are writing school policy then you need to spell out the discipline policy.

Tignanello · My dog name is, Sasha!

Truth-or-Consequences wrote:
No one can control what happens, only limit where it happens as much as possible.

If schools make it 100% impossible on school grounds (not that that's likely... but... work with me here), the bullying will just happen on the way home from school or on the way too school. or in the McDonald's the first time they see the person they want to bully there.

and this is where parents, bystanders and society at large need to step in. It takes a village to raise a child and we all have a hand. If I'm at McD's (okay, I'll admit that I am not usually at McDs) and see a group of kids picking on one? I'll step in. I would expect others to as well.

Truth-or-Consequences · Newbie

No. It's not my answer. I don't have an answer. I wish I did. I just know what can't be done. And schools can't stop bullying. They can stop it on their grounds (maybe), but that leaves a lot of a 24 hour day still available for bullies to bully.

Tignanello · My dog name is, Sasha!

ps. Hi there Truth-or-Consequences. We haven't met yet. Welcome.

Truth-or-Consequences · Newbie

Yes we have... It's me... RichardInTN. Long time no chat!

Tignanello · My dog name is, Sasha!

Hi there!

Tinydancer · Guru

That's you're job LGS. My job is to tell you that what is being done is not enough. Then you'll tell me we'll never stop all bullying...lol. Really? No kidding? How about if it's proven some kid is being harassed by some bully we kick the damn bully out instead of forcing the kid with a lisp or the fat girl or the kid with a birth defect to lea that doesn't include your kid to give up everything to avoid the bully. If someone was doing this to your kid for something they had no control over what would you want? Tell me that if you have an answer

-- Edited by Tinydancer on Saturday 6th of December 2014 11:08:30 PM

Tinydancer · Guru

Tignanello wrote:
Truth-or-Consequences wrote:
No one can control what happens, only limit where it happens as much as possible.

If schools make it 100% impossible on school grounds (not that that's likely... but... work with me here), the bullying will just happen on the way home from school or on the way too school. or in the McDonald's the first time they see the person they want to bully there.
and this is where parents, bystanders and society at large need to step in. It takes a village to raise a child and we all have a hand. If I'm at McD's (okay, I'll admit that I am not usually at McDs) and see a group of kids picking on one? I'll step in. I would expect others to as well.

Bingo! As long as we make excuses and look the other way we can't expect anything to change.

Truth-or-Consequences · Newbie

I do agree that when bullying happens... the bully should be the one forced to leave school.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

The job of kids is everyone's job tiny. So nice try to absolve yourself. But no you cannot eliminate ALL of anything. Sorry to inform you this not a perfect world. And you can't stop someone from saying something because you cant monitor speech until after something is said or done. And we do have policies including expulsion

Tignanello · My dog name is, Sasha!

Truth-or-Consequences wrote:
I do agree that when bullying happens... the bully should be the one forced to leave school.

And be confronted at every turn. And law enforcement involved if necessary.

AND.

The bully needs to be offered help as well. Often those who bully are hurting as well.

Tinydancer · Guru

Truth-or-Consequences wrote:
Yes we have... It's me... RichardInTN. Long time no chat!

Why do I know this name? Have we met? If not nice to meet you TOC!

NAOW · Vette's SS

Tinydancer wrote:
Tignanello wrote:
Truth-or-Consequences wrote:
No one can control what happens, only limit where it happens as much as possible.

If schools make it 100% impossible on school grounds (not that that's likely... but... work with me here), the bullying will just happen on the way home from school or on the way too school. or in the McDonald's the first time they see the person they want to bully there.
and this is where parents, bystanders and society at large need to step in. It takes a village to raise a child and we all have a hand. If I'm at McD's (okay, I'll admit that I am not usually at McDs) and see a group of kids picking on one? I'll step in. I would expect others to as well.
Bingo! As long as we make excuses and look the other way we can't expect anything to change.

I agree. I agree with what Husker is saying too. When it comes to my kid I'm not hanging her happiness on hoping other people do the right thing.

DD's school seems to do a good job- there is a lot more focus than when I was in school anyway. There is a constant dialogue, they get the kids involved, and encourage them to reach out to other kids or step in if a kid is being picked on. She is only in elementary school though, so I'm not sure how well those same approaches would work for older kids.

TOTALLY GEEKED!

Tragedy as boy, 12, kills himself after 'he was bullied for being the only male cheerleader on an all girl team'

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