TOTALLY GEEKED!

Lawyerlady wrote:

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Mellow Momma wrote:

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I know of a living being who serves no purpose other than to look good. This being cannot feed itself, clean up it's living space, or take care of any of its own needs. It is totally dependant on humans for survival. It's life expectancy isn't long. Should I spend money to ensure it lives longer? You seem to be saying no. But if this being is a person...then we should?

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 People have inherent value - they are not comparable. 

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 I am just trying to understand your position. Does an animal life have inherent value?

flan327 wrote:

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Lawyerlady wrote:

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Mellow Momma wrote:

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I know of a living being who serves no purpose other than to look good. This being cannot feed itself, clean up it's living space, or take care of any of its own needs. It is totally dependant on humans for survival. It's life expectancy isn't long. Should I spend money to ensure it lives longer? You seem to be saying no. But if this being is a person...then we should?

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 People have inherent value - they are not comparable. 

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 Even Kim Kardashian?

flan

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Her bootie has probably made more than you have.  

huskerbb wrote:

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flan327 wrote:

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Lawyerlady wrote:

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Mellow Momma wrote:

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I know of a living being who serves no purpose other than to look good. This being cannot feed itself, clean up it's living space, or take care of any of its own needs. It is totally dependant on humans for survival. It's life expectancy isn't long. Should I spend money to ensure it lives longer? You seem to be saying no. But if this being is a person...then we should?

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 People have inherent value - they are not comparable. 

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 Even Kim Kardashian?

flan

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Her bootie has probably made more than you have.  

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 True dat!

flan

huskerbb wrote:

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Mellow Momma wrote:

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Lawyerlady wrote:

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Mellow Momma wrote:

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I know of a living being who serves no purpose other than to look good. This being cannot feed itself, clean up it's living space, or take care of any of its own needs. It is totally dependant on humans for survival. It's life expectancy isn't long. Should I spend money to ensure it lives longer? You seem to be saying no. But if this being is a person...then we should?

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 People have inherent value - they are not comparable. 

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 I am just trying to understand your position. Does an animal life have inherent value?

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Animals have value that humans give them.    

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Our pets are very important to us. That is why we do what it takes, to keep them healthy.

Our Animal Hospital loves us. We have spent thousands, in the past few years.

That is our choice. Our money to spend. The love we get in return, makes it worth it, to us.

Now, if one of our animals got cancer. Or liver failure. Something fatal, and expensive to treat. I'm not sure how far we would go to try to save them.

I hope I never have to find out. 

Mellow Momma wrote:

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Lawyerlady wrote:

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How can you tell if a goldfish needs putting down? When it dies, I flush it. I do not have the time or inclination to spend that much time staring at my goldfish to determine if it is in pain.

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 Well, if you own fish, you can see if it is breathing or not. If it's breathing is slow or labored, it's probably in pain. Just like any other living thing. If it is, like mine was, then you should probably do what you would do for any other pet. 

 

I find it ironic that the "all life is sacred" people are scoffing at someone saving a fish, or putting a fish out of its pain. Very telling. 

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 Gold fish, at least the ones you buy at pet shop or win at a carnival, are in poor health to begin with.  I bought DS two when he was 9, they last 4 days even though we carefully fed them and had a clean tank. Perhaps the fish in the OP is one of those that are very large in a Koi pond?

I know what to do_sometimes wrote:

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Mellow Momma wrote:

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Lawyerlady wrote:

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How can you tell if a goldfish needs putting down? When it dies, I flush it. I do not have the time or inclination to spend that much time staring at my goldfish to determine if it is in pain.

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 Well, if you own fish, you can see if it is breathing or not. If it's breathing is slow or labored, it's probably in pain. Just like any other living thing. If it is, like mine was, then you should probably do what you would do for any other pet. 

 

I find it ironic that the "all life is sacred" people are scoffing at someone saving a fish, or putting a fish out of its pain. Very telling. 

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 Gold fish, at least the ones you buy at pet shop or win at a carnival, are in poor health to begin with.  I bought DS two when he was 9, they last 4 days even though we carefully fed them and had a clean tank. Perhaps the fish in the OP is one of those that are very large in a Koi pond?

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 We had a carnival goldfish that lived 6 years. I kid you not. We couldn't kill it if we tried. So you never know. 

Mellow Momma wrote:

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I feel similarly FWM. I would spend what I could afford, if the likely outcome was going to be good. If the vet told me it was an iffy prognosis, I don't know what I would do. It would probably depend on the amount of money involved.

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We had to spend a lot of money, when we rescued Jupiter. She was a stray. Almost starved. And, she had heartworms.

When the Vet said she was less than 2 years old, we made the decision to spend the money to save her.

Had he said she was 12, I think we would have just kept her comfortable, and happy, till she passed away. 

Southern_Belle wrote:

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My lab tore his ACL. Cost me $1,000. I had just gotten divorced and was broke.

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 I treated my dog for parvo 4 days after we got her.  I've also treated her for erlichiosis since she was covered in ticks when we got her.  We've had weird bumps biopsied and spent over $400 just on that, when they were benign.

Lawyerlady wrote:

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Mellow Momma wrote:

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Lawyerlady wrote:

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Mellow Momma wrote:

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I know of a living being who serves no purpose other than to look good. This being cannot feed itself, clean up it's living space, or take care of any of its own needs. It is totally dependant on humans for survival. It's life expectancy isn't long. Should I spend money to ensure it lives longer? You seem to be saying no. But if this being is a person...then we should?

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 People have inherent value - they are not comparable. 

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 I am just trying to understand your position. Does an animal life have inherent value?

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 Their values differ to different people for different reasons.  But a goldfish?  Spending that much money on a "pet" that could die tomorrow for no reason whatsoever, and NORMALLY lives a very short life seems irresponsible unless you just have money to throw away.  Goldfish are bred to be food or to be pretty in a bowl for a very short time - no other reason.  Some of them will die in a week even if you are the perfect fish owner - I think it irresponsible to get that attached to such a fickle "pet".  Actually, I think the main purpose of fish is to teach children how do deal with death.

A dog has several different purposes; security, companionship, and they can be trained to help the disabled.

Cats have different purposes, too; companionship and rodent control being the main ones. 

 

 

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 I can understand your position. We see things almost the same. I was just curious as to how you reconciled this with your "all life is sacred" belief. This helped my understand. Thanks!

A goldfish has an attention span of less than 10 seconds. If a goldfish detects a predator, it will attempt to flee, but only for 10 seconds.

ed11563 wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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At my cousin's wedding, she had goldfish on the tables we were supposed to take home.  Our kids were like 4 or 5, so we took them home and put them in a jar.

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 That's outrageous.

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????  Silly, maybe--but outrageous?  Why? 

VetteGirl wrote:

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I had goldfish in the bowls at my wedding, turns out it was a terrible idea. We did exactly what the pet store said with the food and water temp and the goldfish were literally floating to the top of the bowls during the reception.

Embarrassing, AND I felt bad for the fish. I don't recommend anyone try it!

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 Beta fish would have been a better idea. Goldfish don't live long in bowls - especially small ones. 

ed11563 wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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ed11563 wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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At my cousin's wedding, she had goldfish on the tables we were supposed to take home.  Our kids were like 4 or 5, so we took them home and put them in a jar.

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 That's outrageous.

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????  Silly, maybe--but outrageous?  Why? 

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It's like having a birthday party for your 6 year old, inviting everyone in his/her class at school, 

then sending every kid home with a kitten. or a puppy. or a bunny.

You're saddling the parents with a living thing they have to take care of, and (especially with a gold fish) dealing with the kids when the pet dies. Or when the parents have  to get rid of a kitten or a puppy they can't deal with adequately.

 

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That is a stupid comparison.  A goldfish is NOT a kitten or a puppy.  You can flush it down the toilet if you don't want it. 

Ever eat sardines, anchovies, pickled herring? 

flan327 wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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ed11563 wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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ed11563 wrote:

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huskerbb wrote:

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At my cousin's wedding, she had goldfish on the tables we were supposed to take home.  Our kids were like 4 or 5, so we took them home and put them in a jar.

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 That's outrageous.

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????  Silly, maybe--but outrageous?  Why? 

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It's like having a birthday party for your 6 year old, inviting everyone in his/her class at school, 

then sending every kid home with a kitten. or a puppy. or a bunny.

You're saddling the parents with a living thing they have to take care of, and (especially with a gold fish) dealing with the kids when the pet dies. Or when the parents have  to get rid of a kitten or a puppy they can't deal with adequately.

 

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That is a stupid comparison.  A goldfish is NOT a kitten or a puppy.  You can flush it down the toilet if you don't want it. 

 

Ever eat sardines, anchovies, pickled herring? 

 

 

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 Do you eat them when they're alive??

flan

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Um, no--but if that is the end of a fish, then a fish is a fish is a fish.  Not remotely the same thing as a puppy.