TOTALLY GEEKED!

Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
totallygeeked -> totallygeeked general -> A Teacher Tells A Story About A Boy In Her Class. It Has A Beginning, A Middle, And No End.
Post Info TOPIC: A Teacher Tells A Story About A Boy In Her Class. It Has A Beginning, A Middle, And No End.
ed11563


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 9186
Date:
A Teacher Tells A Story About A Boy In Her Class. It Has A Beginning, A Middle, And No End.
Permalink  
 

 

 

A Teacher Tells A Story About A Boy In Her Class. It Has A Beginning, A Middle, And No End.

 

http://www.upworthy.com/a-teacher-tells-a-story-about-a-boy-in-her-class-it-has-a-beginning-a-middle-and-no-end?c=upw1

 

As troubling as these stories are, they beg the question: If they're not supposed to make us feel bad, what are we supposed to do now that we know? For starters, it should help put an end to all those calls for the poor to "pull themselves up by their bootstraps." Second, it's important to support policies that address poverty in meaningful ways — ensuring a living wage, keeping welfare benefits up-to-date with inflation, and a lot more.

Awareness is only as good as the action it inspires.

Transcript:

First Call: BC Child and Youth Advocacy Coalition 2014 BC Child Poverty Report Card Press Conference

November 24, 2014

Anna Chudnovsky Elementary School Teacher

Anna Chudnovsky: My name is Anna Chudnovsky, and I teach grade three in the inner city. I don't have a lot of numbers to share with you today, instead I have the story of a real student and his family. A story that I hope will tell you a little bit about what it's like to be a student living in poverty. I am telling you this story not because it's sad, but because I believe that being poor makes it hard to learn, and when it's too hard to learn lifting yourself out of the poverty you're born into is incredibly hard.

There is a boy in my class. He is Aboriginal, he is eight years old, he's the oldest and he has a younger brother and a younger sister, and his mom is pregnant and due to give birth any day now. The family has just moved here from Smithers because his mom is trying to start fresh and give her children some of the opportunities that she didn't herself have. The family lives in BC housing. This boy is smart, he is capable, he is kind, he is friendly. He helps others, he tries his best at school, but his life is too hard. The task he has in front of him is too grand, too monstrous to overcome. You see, he's poor, and when you're poor, as poor as he is, succeeding at school is such a very difficult challenge.

We have a walking school bus at our school that picks up the kids from home, in the housing complexes in the neighborhood and brings them to school. It helps to get the kids to school on time, it builds a bit of community, and it takes some of the stress of the before school rush off the parent's shoulders.

The walking school bus picked up this child last week, and when the support worker got to the door the mom, nine months pregnant, in a new city, trying to build her new life, confided in the worker that she had no groceries. She had only one single jar of olives in her fridge, and she started to cry. She was worried that she wouldn't have time to get groceries before the baby arrived. She's panicked that she won't be ready. Her son, my student, my kind, smart, lovely student, tried to comfort his mom as she stood there crying in the doorway. He is eight years old. And then he came to school to try to learn.

We're working on adding with regrouping in my class, his family is in utter crisis, and he is trying to learn to carry the one. This same boy earlier in the year when the weather was just getting cold was wearing flip flops to school. I asked him if he had another pair of shoes and he said no, so I took him to the clothes room at our school. Yes, we have a clothes room. He chose a pair, and he looked very proud. When he ran off to go join his friends in the playground he called back to me, "I'll bring back the shoes at the end of the day!"

You see, he thought that I had given him the shoes just for the day, for his time at school. He felt so unentitled to shoes that he thought he had to give them back to me. That lack of self-worth is devastating. It prevents you from opening your mind to learning. It makes focusing on adding, or writing a persuasive paragraph, or learning the water cycle nearly impossible.

This same boy's brother fell in the schoolyard last week. He tripped on a curb and got a concussion. Our secretary tried to call home, but the line was out of order. She walked to the home, got the mom, brought her back to the school, and told her about her youngest son, and she advised her to take him to the hospital to get it checked out. But you see, the Mom didn't have bus fare for herself and her three children to get to the hospital. She was desperately ashamed to admit it, but she didn't know how she could possibly manage the trip.

So this is a family living in poverty. This is a boy who is trying to learn how to carry the one while his life is in upheaval. New city, new community, new school, new sibling, new stress. No shoes, no money, no support for a mother trying her best to provide for her kids, to give them a good start. And this kid, this sweet, smart, thoughtful boy, is just trying his best to learn.

To be clear, this is just one story of one student in my class. I could tell you others of refugee families making a new home for themselves with a child who has nightmares every night of his father being shot in front of him, or of a student who was physically pulled away from the only parent she's ever known, or of a child living with her disabled grandmother and having to, at ten years old, do all the cooking, cleaning, shopping and maintenance, because this grandmother is the only one in the family who was able to nurture and love her.

I could tell you about a girl and her brother who chase the mice that live in their house back and forth from one bedroom to the other as a game. I could tell you about a little girl whose dad carefully butters one single piece of bread for her to take for lunch every day. There's more of them, too, and they're all just trying to learn, and it's too hard, because learning is about taking risks and trying your best, and it's about sometimes making mistakes, and when you're poor, when you're so poor that you're worried and anxious and insecure, learning to carry the one is almost impossible.

 

 

 



__________________

The Principle of Least Interest: He who cares least about a relationship, controls it.

Always misinterpret when you can.
huskerbb


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 10215
Date:
Permalink  
 

Yes, we all feel for children in circumstances such as these--but when do we hold these deadbeat parents accountable?
His mom is PREGNANT???? What opportunities does she think she is going to have? Getting and keeping a job is going to be exceedingly difficult.

Keep your legs closed. Sure, one kid, maybe even two, is a mistake. After that, it's a pattern, a lifestyle choice.

__________________

I'm not arguing, I'm just explaining why I'm right.

 

Well, I could agree with you--but then we'd both be wrong.
Lexxy


My dog name is Sasha, too!

Status: Offline
Posts: 6679
Date:
Permalink  
 

That was my thought too Husker. I feel for the kid but it appears there is no father in the picture & the mom is pregnant AGAIN. She made poor choices & it is directly affecting her children. She needs to change her behavior before anything can improve.

__________________
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

I agree with you that the mother needs to take responsibility for her actions and quit getting pregnant. But that isn't the little boy's fault. In the meantime, he is hungry and has no adequate clothing. How he got to that situation is a separate issue. What can we do for him NOW so that we can break the cycle of poverty and he can get his education?

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
huskerbb


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 10215
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:

I agree with you that the mother needs to take responsibility for her actions and quit getting pregnant. But that isn't the little boy's fault. In the meantime, he is hungry and has no adequate clothing. How he got to that situation is a separate issue. What can we do for him NOW so that we can break the cycle of poverty and he can get his education?

 No, they are not separate issues.  They could hardly be more intertwined. 



__________________

I'm not arguing, I'm just explaining why I'm right.

 

Well, I could agree with you--but then we'd both be wrong.
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

I agree with you that the mother needs to take responsibility for her actions and quit getting pregnant. But that isn't the little boy's fault. In the meantime, he is hungry and has no adequate clothing. How he got to that situation is a separate issue. What can we do for him NOW so that we can break the cycle of poverty and he can get his education?

 No, they are not separate issues.  They could hardly be more intertwined. 

 So we shouldn't help the boy because his mom keeps getting pregnant? 

I understand that he is in this situation because of his mother's choices. But the facts are, it is not his fault. He has no shoes, and he is starving. His mother is unlikely to change and frankly it's too late - he is already at risk. If she stops having sex now it's too late. Let's help him and let's get him educated so he learns to make better choices. 



__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
huskerbb


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 10215
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

I agree with you that the mother needs to take responsibility for her actions and quit getting pregnant. But that isn't the little boy's fault. In the meantime, he is hungry and has no adequate clothing. How he got to that situation is a separate issue. What can we do for him NOW so that we can break the cycle of poverty and he can get his education?

 No, they are not separate issues.  They could hardly be more intertwined. 

 So we shouldn't help the boy because his mom keeps getting pregnant? 

I understand that he is in this situation because of his mother's choices. But the facts are, it is not his fault. He has no shoes, and he is starving. His mother is unlikely to change and frankly it's too late - he is already at risk. If she stops having sex now it's too late. Let's help him and let's get him educated so he learns to make better choices. 

We've been throwing millions and billions of dollars per year at this problem for some FIFTY odd years, now.  If throwing money at it was going to work, it would have done so.

 

We have WIC, EBT, Head Start, SNAP, and many other welfare programs.  Sure, they fill a short term need--but they do NOTHING to make future generations make better choices.  In fact, they contribute to a culture of dependency on the government and pretty much have ensured that this becomes a multi-generational problem.   



__________________

I'm not arguing, I'm just explaining why I'm right.

 

Well, I could agree with you--but then we'd both be wrong.
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

So let's try throwing money at education instead! Education budgets are getting cut every year, with more and more kids in the school system needing services. Instead of throwing money at welfare, let's throw it at education! Feeding them (WIC, SNAP etc) doesn't make the kids smarter, it just helps them be prepared to learn. Let's get programs started in the schools to teach these kids impulse control, how to make choices...etc instead of just saying "the parents should be doing it". Yes they should be. But they arent. So someone has to or the end result will be exactly the same. And we will still be here bitching about it not changing, while we haven't done a single thing to improve it! Continuing down the same course that we know doesn't work is insanity by definition.

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
I know what to do_sometimes


Frozen Sucks!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24384
Date:
Permalink  
 

huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

I agree with you that the mother needs to take responsibility for her actions and quit getting pregnant. But that isn't the little boy's fault. In the meantime, he is hungry and has no adequate clothing. How he got to that situation is a separate issue. What can we do for him NOW so that we can break the cycle of poverty and he can get his education?

 No, they are not separate issues.  They could hardly be more intertwined. 

 So we shouldn't help the boy because his mom keeps getting pregnant? 

I understand that he is in this situation because of his mother's choices. But the facts are, it is not his fault. He has no shoes, and he is starving. His mother is unlikely to change and frankly it's too late - he is already at risk. If she stops having sex now it's too late. Let's help him and let's get him educated so he learns to make better choices. 

We've been throwing millions and billions of dollars per year at this problem for some FIFTY odd years, now.  If throwing money at it was going to work, it would have done so.

 

We have WIC, EBT, Head Start, SNAP, and many other welfare programs.  Sure, they fill a short term need--but they do NOTHING to make future generations make better choices.  In fact, they contribute to a culture of dependency on the government and pretty much have ensured that this becomes a multi-generational problem.   

 Don't forget the food pantries and Salvation Army for the clothing and countless other privately funded and publicly funded organizations.  Mom doesn't want the help probably because she is worried the kids will be taken from her due to neglect.  And olives?????  Really?  How about spending that money on peanut butter or some other filling food.



__________________

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Frozen is the bestest movie ever, NOT!
I know what to do_sometimes


Frozen Sucks!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24384
Date:
Permalink  
 

Now, if one of DD's friends had no shoes, you better believe I would get her some. I used to feed DS' friends dinner when their parents couldn't, and at a time when I was living paycheck to paycheck. Sometimes I didn't eat just so there was enough food. This mom is holding back. With all the help out there and free food at school, there is no way she shouldn't have more food in the house. Selling her benefits for drugs perhaps.

__________________

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Frozen is the bestest movie ever, NOT!
huskerbb


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 10215
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:

So let's try throwing money at education instead! Education budgets are getting cut every year, with more and more kids in the school system needing services. Instead of throwing money at welfare, let's throw it at education! Feeding them (WIC, SNAP etc) doesn't make the kids smarter, it just helps them be prepared to learn. Let's get programs started in the schools to teach these kids impulse control, how to make choices...etc instead of just saying "the parents should be doing it". Yes they should be. But they arent. So someone has to or the end result will be exactly the same. And we will still be here bitching about it not changing, while we haven't done a single thing to improve it! Continuing down the same course that we know doesn't work is insanity by definition.

I'll bet you will find that per pupil, the money spent on education has RISEN dramatically over that same time period. 

 

Some problems cannot be fixed with money.  



__________________

I'm not arguing, I'm just explaining why I'm right.

 

Well, I could agree with you--but then we'd both be wrong.
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

I know what to do_sometimes wrote:

Now, if one of DD's friends had no shoes, you better believe I would get her some. I used to feed DS' friends dinner when their parents couldn't, and at a time when I was living paycheck to paycheck. Sometimes I didn't eat just so there was enough food. This mom is holding back. With all the help out there and free food at school, there is no way she shouldn't have more food in the house. Selling her benefits for drugs perhaps.

 She is a refugee from a foreign country. I doubt she is selling it for drugs. She probably doesn't know what is available to her or can't navigate the system because of language issues. 



__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
I know what to do_sometimes


Frozen Sucks!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24384
Date:
Permalink  
 

huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

So let's try throwing money at education instead! Education budgets are getting cut every year, with more and more kids in the school system needing services. Instead of throwing money at welfare, let's throw it at education! Feeding them (WIC, SNAP etc) doesn't make the kids smarter, it just helps them be prepared to learn. Let's get programs started in the schools to teach these kids impulse control, how to make choices...etc instead of just saying "the parents should be doing it". Yes they should be. But they arent. So someone has to or the end result will be exactly the same. And we will still be here bitching about it not changing, while we haven't done a single thing to improve it! Continuing down the same course that we know doesn't work is insanity by definition.

I'll bet you will find that per pupil, the money spent on education has RISEN dramatically over that same time period. 

 

Some problems cannot be fixed with money.  

 If the parent isn't taking care of their child, the child should be taken away and most certainly no welfare should be going to that parent.  If you are a single parent, have young kids and don't work, you receive rent free housing, food stamps, cash, fuel assistance, a cell phone, kids get breakfast and lunch free in school, you are eligible to get food from the food pantries.  There is no excuse for this kid's situation except that his mother is irresponsible and neglectful.  She shouldn't have custody of her kids.



-- Edited by I know what to do_sometimes on Thursday 8th of January 2015 05:36:04 PM

__________________

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Frozen is the bestest movie ever, NOT!
huskerbb


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 10215
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:

Now, if one of DD's friends had no shoes, you better believe I would get her some. I used to feed DS' friends dinner when their parents couldn't, and at a time when I was living paycheck to paycheck. Sometimes I didn't eat just so there was enough food. This mom is holding back. With all the help out there and free food at school, there is no way she shouldn't have more food in the house. Selling her benefits for drugs perhaps.

 She is a refugee from a foreign country. I doubt she is selling it for drugs. She probably doesn't know what is available to her or can't navigate the system because of language issues. 

Well then this teacher is ignorant.  Instead of whining about this situation--she should direct her to services already available that can help.

 

 



__________________

I'm not arguing, I'm just explaining why I'm right.

 

Well, I could agree with you--but then we'd both be wrong.
I know what to do_sometimes


Frozen Sucks!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24384
Date:
Permalink  
 

huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:

Now, if one of DD's friends had no shoes, you better believe I would get her some. I used to feed DS' friends dinner when their parents couldn't, and at a time when I was living paycheck to paycheck. Sometimes I didn't eat just so there was enough food. This mom is holding back. With all the help out there and free food at school, there is no way she shouldn't have more food in the house. Selling her benefits for drugs perhaps.

 She is a refugee from a foreign country. I doubt she is selling it for drugs. She probably doesn't know what is available to her or can't navigate the system because of language issues. 

Well then this teacher is ignorant.  Instead of whining about this situation--she should direct her to services already available that can help.

 

 

 All the welfare offices help people with contacts for the free services.  If she has an issue because she is foreign, well, perhaps she should have stayed in her own country.  So we are supporting yet another family from a foreign country, not Americans.  Nice!  Take more away from American poor.



__________________

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Frozen is the bestest movie ever, NOT!
huskerbb


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 10215
Date:
Permalink  
 

I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:

Now, if one of DD's friends had no shoes, you better believe I would get her some. I used to feed DS' friends dinner when their parents couldn't, and at a time when I was living paycheck to paycheck. Sometimes I didn't eat just so there was enough food. This mom is holding back. With all the help out there and free food at school, there is no way she shouldn't have more food in the house. Selling her benefits for drugs perhaps.

 She is a refugee from a foreign country. I doubt she is selling it for drugs. She probably doesn't know what is available to her or can't navigate the system because of language issues. 

Well then this teacher is ignorant.  Instead of whining about this situation--she should direct her to services already available that can help.

 

 

 All the welfare offices help people with contacts for the free services.  If she has an issue because she is foreign, well, perhaps she should have stayed in her own country.  So we are supporting yet another family from a foreign country, not Americans.  Nice!  Take more away from American poor.

I think this particular story is from either Canada or Australia--but the point remains the same.  Their welfare programs are very similar to ours, and in the case of Canada, probably better, from the perspective of the poor, anyway.  



__________________

I'm not arguing, I'm just explaining why I'm right.

 

Well, I could agree with you--but then we'd both be wrong.
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

This is a Canadian story - FYI. The reference to BC I believe is British Columbia - thus the Aboriginal reference. 



-- Edited by Mellow Momma on Thursday 8th of January 2015 06:01:51 PM

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
flan327


Itty bitty's Grammy

Status: Offline
Posts: 28124
Date:
Permalink  
 

Yeah, I caught that it wasn't America.

flan

__________________

You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

So what do you suggest then? The mother needs to stop having kids. I AGREE! That doesn't put shoes on the boys' feet or food in his belly, and it doesn't teach him to make better choices.

What is the solution?

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

Sorry, I lack sympathy for this mother. She is on baby number four and not a single father in the house? Terribly poor choices by her. The kids would qualify for free lunches so there is no reason this boy should not have at least two hot meals a day. And for gods sake, if you can't afford the kids you have stop having more! This isn't rocket science. When SS's mom was on food stamps SS ate two meals a day on the free lunch program and was either at our house or his grandma's house from Friday after school to late Sunday night. So all his mom had to feed him was four meals A WEEK. Yet she was getting food stamps to feed him all week. Once kids get in school the amount of food stamps should drop if they are on the free food program. And I agree, what's with the olives? That's the last thing I'd buy if I had little money. And if she can't take care of the kids maybe someone does need to come in and investigate the home. Kids should NOT have to live like this because their parents are idiots.

We have a site here in my town on FB that's called Free in... You can ask for or give away things. I am constantly amazed at people and their bad decisions. Just last night a guy posted that he and his g/f have no money but they're moving into an apartment to get away from their parents. They don't have money for food, furniture, or bills. I am constantly seeing people begging for baby food and formula. Last night there was a lady on there that said she had a baby and didn't have a car seat for the baby. People directed her to free places to get one but she didn't have a car to get there. One guy wanted to know if there was a delivery truck that would bring his food stamp purchases to him from the grocery store. Sure, there are some good things on there but overall I see a lot of people making bad choices and expecting everyone else to fix them for them. One lady was posting for a couple she knew. They were illegal aliens living in a hotel and the lady was pregnant. They couldn't get benefits because they were illegal. He couldn't find work. They were begging for food. "Just rice and beans". So you come here illegally and then expect others to support that choice? Sorry. I can't get behind all this. Like husker says, we've been throwing money at these problems for decades and it hasn't helped.

Should kids have to go without? Absolutely not. But there are definitely some parents out there that the more you do for the kids the less they will do for them. So where do you draw the line? When do we start making parents responsible for their own kids and their own choices?

__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
I know what to do_sometimes


Frozen Sucks!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24384
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:

So what do you suggest then? The mother needs to stop having kids. I AGREE! That doesn't put shoes on the boys' feet or food in his belly, and it doesn't teach him to make better choices.

What is the solution?

 Take the kids away from the neglectful mother, stop supporting her and her bad or criminal decisions.  Yeah I get all foster care is not great but it sure as hell is better than what these kids are getting now.



__________________

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Frozen is the bestest movie ever, NOT!
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
flan327


Itty bitty's Grammy

Status: Offline
Posts: 28124
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

 She's falling through the cracks & has lost her support system. She needs help.

flan



__________________

You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

I think someone needs to come investigate this woman. If she's here illegally that needs to be addressed. If she qualifies for services and isn't applying that needs to be addressed. Where are the fathers and why are they not helping? THAT needs to be addressed. Is she doing ANYTHING to help herself or just laying up with different men and making babies? THAT needs to be addressed. I mean, what ARE her plans for her future? It can't be to simply do the same as she's doing right now. The teacher says she's stressed and worried and trying to make a better life for her kids. HOW? How is she trying to make a better life? By pumping out kids? Does she have a job? Doesn't sound like it. She actually doesn't sound like she's trying to change all that much to me.

__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

flan327 wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

 She's falling through the cracks & has lost her support system. She needs help.

flan

 Exactly. She needs someone to be her advocate and teact her how to advocate for herself. She is pregnant in a new city. She left her old situation because it wasn't good for her children. It doesn't say, but you have to wonder if she left an abusive husband ? That could be why there is no father in the story. Most aboriginal men are alcoholics. She. Any be in a better situation now. 

 

No one is going to hire a pregnant woman. She needs to seek out services, but she is in a strange city. She may think of she reaches out to someone at the school, that her kids will be taken away.



__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:

I think someone needs to come investigate this woman. If she's here illegally that needs to be addressed. If she qualifies for services and isn't applying that needs to be addressed. Where are the fathers and why are they not helping? THAT needs to be addressed. Is she doing ANYTHING to help herself or just laying up with different men and making babies? THAT needs to be addressed. I mean, what ARE her plans for her future? It can't be to simply do the same as she's doing right now. The teacher says she's stressed and worried and trying to make a better life for her kids. HOW? How is she trying to make a better life? By pumping out kids? Does she have a job? Doesn't sound like it. She actually doesn't sound like she's trying to change all that much to me.

 She is trying to make a better life by leaving the remote village where aboriginals are and moving to the city where her kids can get an education. 

 

Nothing says ways her children have multiple fathers. Don't assume. 

 

Who would hire a pregnant woman? No one. 

 

I am not making excuses for her. Just trying to show that it isnt as black and white as we want it to be. 



__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

Well, if she brought the father from the remote village where the hell is he? So let's assume all the kids have the same dad which doesn't even make sense. But let's assume. She needs to stop having kids. Period. She could get a job if she wasn't pregnant all the damn time.

You ARE making excuses for her. She should have had a plan when she came here. You don't just show up somewhere with no idea of how you're going to take care of yourself or yours kids. That's dumb.

And yes, I can judge. I WAS in that situation. Three kids, nowhere to go, no education, no money. I didn't add to my situation by having more kids. Yes, I got help. But I also immediately made a plan to get out of the situation I was in.

This woman does not sound like she has any plans other than having kids. I refuse to feel sorry for her.

__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
flan327


Itty bitty's Grammy

Status: Offline
Posts: 28124
Date:
Permalink  
 

I have no idea what life is like on a Canadian reservation. The fact that she moved to a city where she has no support system had to be scary.

flan

__________________

You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

I have no problem helping people out. I really don't. What I have a problem with is supporting people. If YOU (general you) have a plan to help get yourself out of poverty then I think you should get support and deserve it. If your plans are to sit on welfare until something figures itself out then no, I don't think you should get help OR sympathy. Life doesn't "work itself out". You work life out.

__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
I know what to do_sometimes


Frozen Sucks!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24384
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

 I would take her kids away because she is neglectful.  Nothing wrong with being poor, but if you aren't taking care of your kids with all the welfare services available, there is something wrong with you.  (her).



__________________

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Frozen is the bestest movie ever, NOT!
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

 I would take her kids away because she is neglectful.  Nothing wrong with being poor, but if you aren't taking care of your kids with all the welfare services available, there is something wrong with you.  (her).

 What if she is uneduacted and sincerely doesn't know what is available to her? She is from the Canadian wilderness and now lives in the city. She probably has no clue what is available. 



__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
I know what to do_sometimes


Frozen Sucks!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24384
Date:
Permalink  
 

Believe me MM, NJN and I have both been those poor parents. We get what there is out there for help and understand what MOST (and i mean MOST) mothers are all about. We have compassion for those trying to get a leg up but not for those that neglect their children. There is no reason in the US, Canada, and many other country for this kid to be hungry or without good shoes. The mother is an ass.

__________________

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Frozen is the bestest movie ever, NOT!
I know what to do_sometimes


Frozen Sucks!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24384
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

 I would take her kids away because she is neglectful.  Nothing wrong with being poor, but if you aren't taking care of your kids with all the welfare services available, there is something wrong with you.  (her).

 What if she is uneduacted and sincerely doesn't know what is available to her? She is from the Canadian wilderness and now lives in the city. She probably has no clue what is available. 

 BS, registering your child for school will put one in touch with social services. If she is that ignorant, the kids need to be taken if she doesn't get help.



__________________

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

Frozen is the bestest movie ever, NOT!
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

I just think there are factors here that none of us can even imagine. We are not a marginalized population, from a remote wilderness area moving to a populated city where we don't speak the language. Yes, she should have had a plan. But maybe her plan was get the hell out of an abusive, terrible situation and then regroup. The regrouping needs to start yesterday, no doubt. But I have not walked a mile on her shoes. It's easy to look at her and judge, but we aren't her. I think she needs educated and she needs services. I don't think she should get them for her entire life...she needs a plan and she needs to keep up her end of the deal. No more babies, work toward a professional certificate of some kind, or a degree and get a job. I don't think welfare should be a lifestyle, but I think she deserves the benefit of the doubt until she proves she isn't doing her share to get back on her feet. She may be at rock bottom and just needs someone to show her the way out. Not everyone can see the way out for themselves.

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

 I would take her kids away because she is neglectful.  Nothing wrong with being poor, but if you aren't taking care of your kids with all the welfare services available, there is something wrong with you.  (her).

 What if she is uneduacted and sincerely doesn't know what is available to her? She is from the Canadian wilderness and now lives in the city. She probably has no clue what is available. 

 So she knows nothing?  She doesn't ask the teacher or school counselor?  She doesn't look in a phone book?  She doesn't talk to other neighbors?  She doesn't read signs or watch tv?  This stuff is everywhere.  She is not making an effort to FIND the resources.  I promise you this, and I can say it because I have actually BEEN IN this situation, if I had nothing and my kids needed something I wouldn't stop asking until I found answers.  Again, she can't sit in her house and expect everyone to knock on the door and just give her what she needs.



__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

I think there is probably a language barrier. That a cultural issue - aboriginals don't trust most government workers.

Look - I agree with you. I would stop at nothing if my kids were hungry. I would beg borrow and steal if I had to. But clearly she needs help. I am not saying she is in the right. I am saying let's take a moment to quit judging and work on stopping the culture that creates this situation. Let's feed, clothe and educate her children so they don't make the same mistakes. Continuing to give inner city kids sub standard educations, and not fixing the problem ensures they remain exactly where they are.

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
voiceofreason


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 1089
Date:
Permalink  
 

Njn, you and I were in incredibly similar circumstances. I choose to have sympathy. There is something unique in me that allowed me to get out of poverty, I don't believe for one moment that just because I did others can. Most women can't. I know for a fact that I am an exception to the rule and I'm grateful to have that extra oomph in me that allowed me to do better. It's like saying if micheal Phelps can win a gold, anyone can. No. No they can't. There's something in us that allows us to be better, do better.

As to the op. Wtf is that woman thinking having another kid? Wtf is wrong with her to not get her children proper food and clothing? You know what? If you can't get on your feet because you have too many kids and not enough money,put your kids in fostercare, get your **** together, go get your children and be responsible.



__________________

I'm the Ginger Rogers of spelling...that means I'm smat.

Lesson learned in February:  I don't have to keep up, I just have to keep moving!

 
flan327


Itty bitty's Grammy

Status: Offline
Posts: 28124
Date:
Permalink  
 

Can the woman read? How much education does she have? What's her IQ?

flan

__________________

You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

Eh, make all the excuses you want. Throwing money at the problem has been proven to NOT help. It only makes the cycle repeat itself.

__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
flan327


Itty bitty's Grammy

Status: Offline
Posts: 28124
Date:
Permalink  
 

Mellow Momma wrote:

I just think there are factors here that none of us can even imagine. We are not a marginalized population, from a remote wilderness area moving to a populated city where we don't speak the language. Yes, she should have had a plan. But maybe her plan was get the hell out of an abusive, terrible situation and then regroup. The regrouping needs to start yesterday, no doubt. But I have not walked a mile on her shoes. It's easy to look at her and judge, but we aren't her. I think she needs educated and she needs services. I don't think she should get them for her entire life...she needs a plan and she needs to keep up her end of the deal. No more babies, work toward a professional certificate of some kind, or a degree and get a job. I don't think welfare should be a lifestyle, but I think she deserves the benefit of the doubt until she proves she isn't doing her share to get back on her feet. She may be at rock bottom and just needs someone to show her the way out. Not everyone can see the way out for themselves.

 Thank you for stating the obvious.

flan



__________________

You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

flan327 wrote:

Can the woman read? How much education does she have? What's her IQ?

flan

 So you're assuming she has a low IQ, no education, and can't read?  That's a lot of assuming there.



__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
flan327


Itty bitty's Grammy

Status: Offline
Posts: 28124
Date:
Permalink  
 

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
flan327 wrote:

Can the woman read? How much education does she have? What's her IQ?

flan

 So you're assuming she has a low IQ, no education, and can't read?  That's a lot of assuming there.

 Nope, just asking questions. Her situation is different from yours & IKWTDS.

flan



__________________

You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

 I would take her kids away because she is neglectful.  Nothing wrong with being poor, but if you aren't taking care of your kids with all the welfare services available, there is something wrong with you.  (her).

 What if she is uneduacted and sincerely doesn't know what is available to her? She is from the Canadian wilderness and now lives in the city. She probably has no clue what is available. 

 BS, registering your child for school will put one in touch with social services. If she is that ignorant, the kids need to be taken if she doesn't get help.

 Clearly her kid is in school and they did not put her in touch with social services! I registered my kids for school, when I was broke and qualified for services, and I don't recall anyone asking me if I needed social services. There are no income questions on a school registration form! Just because someone talked to you about it doesn't mean they talked to her about it. Every school system is different. Especially in other countries. 



__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

flan327 wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

I just think there are factors here that none of us can even imagine. We are not a marginalized population, from a remote wilderness area moving to a populated city where we don't speak the language. Yes, she should have had a plan. But maybe her plan was get the hell out of an abusive, terrible situation and then regroup. The regrouping needs to start yesterday, no doubt. But I have not walked a mile on her shoes. It's easy to look at her and judge, but we aren't her. I think she needs educated and she needs services. I don't think she should get them for her entire life...she needs a plan and she needs to keep up her end of the deal. No more babies, work toward a professional certificate of some kind, or a degree and get a job. I don't think welfare should be a lifestyle, but I think she deserves the benefit of the doubt until she proves she isn't doing her share to get back on her feet. She may be at rock bottom and just needs someone to show her the way out. Not everyone can see the way out for themselves.

 Thank you for stating the obvious.

flan

 But I can judge because I have been there.  I have walked a mile in her shoes.  I didn't leave an abusive husband.  He left me for a mistress.  I most definitely can imagine the factors.  I can imagine what it was like asking my parents for shelter and being turned down.  This woman has more than I had to start out with.  So unless she just recently came to Canada she got pregnant while she was there.  She needs to quit having kids and get a plan together.  And yes, she can do that while she is pregnant.  And if her kids are going to school then there is someone at her kids school she can talk to even if she doesn't speak the language.  They have to provide a translator.  They could give her info.  Someone has to make the first move and since they are HER kids it's up to her.  It's NOT societies responsibility to take care of your (general you) kids.



__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
flan327 wrote:

Can the woman read? How much education does she have? What's her IQ?

flan

 So you're assuming she has a low IQ, no education, and can't read?  That's a lot of assuming there.

 If she grew up in the wilderness or on a reservation, the chances are she is illiterate. 

 

Remember, I agree with her not being on welfare for life. I just think we need to give her a start first. Then, when she fails to hold up her end of the bargain, we can get mad and judge. 



__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
flan327


Itty bitty's Grammy

Status: Offline
Posts: 28124
Date:
Permalink  
 

The family has just moved here from Smithers because his mom is trying to start fresh and give her children some of the opportunities that she didn't herself have.

Smithers is a town of 5400 in British Columbia. The letter doesn't say where she moved to, however.

flan

__________________

You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.
Mellow Momma


Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline
Posts: 7536
Date:
Permalink  
 

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
flan327 wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

I just think there are factors here that none of us can even imagine. We are not a marginalized population, from a remote wilderness area moving to a populated city where we don't speak the language. Yes, she should have had a plan. But maybe her plan was get the hell out of an abusive, terrible situation and then regroup. The regrouping needs to start yesterday, no doubt. But I have not walked a mile on her shoes. It's easy to look at her and judge, but we aren't her. I think she needs educated and she needs services. I don't think she should get them for her entire life...she needs a plan and she needs to keep up her end of the deal. No more babies, work toward a professional certificate of some kind, or a degree and get a job. I don't think welfare should be a lifestyle, but I think she deserves the benefit of the doubt until she proves she isn't doing her share to get back on her feet. She may be at rock bottom and just needs someone to show her the way out. Not everyone can see the way out for themselves.

 Thank you for stating the obvious.

flan

 But I can judge because I have been there.  I have walked a mile in her shoes.  I didn't leave an abusive husband.  He left me for a mistress.  I most definitely can imagine the factors.  I can imagine what it was like asking my parents for shelter and being turned down.  This woman has more than I had to start out with.  So unless she just recently came to Canada she got pregnant while she was there.  She needs to quit having kids and get a plan together.  And yes, she can do that while she is pregnant.  And if her kids are going to school then there is someone at her kids school she can talk to even if she doesn't speak the language.  They have to provide a translator.  They could give her info.  Someone has to make the first move and since they are HER kids it's up to her.  It's NOT societies responsibility to take care of your (general you) kids.

 My point is she probably doesn't know that talking to someone at school will even help! She probably has no idea ! She probably doesn't know they have to give her a translator! You can't assume she knows that would help at all! 



__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite ! 
huskerbb


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 10215
Date:
Permalink  
 

There is no indication that she does not speak English. Even if she is a native, she's from CANADA for God's sakes. They have schools on all the reservations and in every village. Native languages are barely spoken, anymore. It's HIGHLY likely she knows more English than a native language. That is NOT a "barrier" here.

__________________

I'm not arguing, I'm just explaining why I'm right.

 

Well, I could agree with you--but then we'd both be wrong.
huskerbb


Guru

Status: Offline
Posts: 10215
Date:
Permalink  
 

She "confided" in the worker that she had no groceries. She communicated her "worries" to said worker. She speaks English.

__________________

I'm not arguing, I'm just explaining why I'm right.

 

Well, I could agree with you--but then we'd both be wrong.
Nobody Just Nobody


Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline
Posts: 24026
Date:
Permalink  
 

I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
I know what to do_sometimes wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:

Would you advocate for orphanages? Group homes? Or just family foster care?

Are you saying take her kids away because she is poor or because she isn't availiling herself of the services she doesn't know are available ? She is aboriginal - she was raised on a reservation and likely has no idea about food banks, welfare, etc.

 I would take her kids away because she is neglectful.  Nothing wrong with being poor, but if you aren't taking care of your kids with all the welfare services available, there is something wrong with you.  (her).

 What if she is uneduacted and sincerely doesn't know what is available to her? She is from the Canadian wilderness and now lives in the city. She probably has no clue what is available. 

 BS, registering your child for school will put one in touch with social services. If she is that ignorant, the kids need to be taken if she doesn't get help.

 But here is the thing.  She continues to have kids she can't take care of.  These children are HER RESPONSIBILITY.  Should we help her?  Yes.  But it is not societies responsibility to hunt everyone and make sure they all have what they need.  Sometimes you have to open your own mouth and ask.  The teacher says several people from the school have been out to her home.  Why hasn't someone reported her?  Why hasn't someone talked to her?  Why hasn't SHE talked to the teachers? 

This story is all lovely and good and well designed to make one feel guilty for having what they worked for but I'm not buying it.  Don't know English?  Learn it.  Don't know how to read?  Learn.  Don't have a high school diploma?  Get it.  You either choose to be a victim or you choose to succeed.



__________________


“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou
1 2  >  Last»  | Page of 2  sorted by
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.
totallygeeked -> totallygeeked general -> A Teacher Tells A Story About A Boy In Her Class. It Has A Beginning, A Middle, And No End.


Create your own FREE Forum
Report Abuse 		Powered by ActiveBoard