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TOPIC: Naked mentally ill woman who died in police custody after being tasered and restrained by 5 deputies

Lady Gaga Snerd

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Date: Sep 12, 2015

RE: Naked mentally ill woman who died in police custody after being tasered and restrained by 5 deputies	Permalink

Somebody probably loved her on Earth. And, even if they didn't, God loved her. What a horrible disregard for the life of this mentally ill woman. As Christ said, as you do the LEAST, you do to ME. __________________ https://politicsandstuff.proboards.com/

Lawyerlady

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huskerbb wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
And the police need to be trained in MORE than just subduing everyone with violence. They should be trained to RECOGNIZE a mental issue such as this, so they can call in the appropriate help. No one says they have to know how to medically treat her, but they do need to know to treat her differently.
No, they don't. Different rules don't apply to them. That's BS.

Yes, they do. A mentally ill person with schizophrenia is not going to react to being forcibly subdued the same way a normal person would. And that is NOT HER FAULT.

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Nobody Just Nobody

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The police are not really trained in dealing with the mentally ill. That's not the fault of the policemen. That's on the higher ups who need to have training for them. I don't put that on them at all. Someone has to set up a system to teach them about this. Because if they don't know how to recognize and deal with it they will treat her like they did. Also, in these little jails they DO NOT keep major drugs. If someone has an issue they call an ambulance and have them taken to the hospital. The police do not, and cannot, just "give a shot". Also, some of the drugs listed are no longer used unless it is absolutely life and death because many of them have been show to have severe side effects. Oh, and little known fact, giving a drug to make someone "fall over" is considered physical restraint which falls into the same category as tazing them. And when you give someone a shot it can take half and hour to an hour and a half for it to take action. If the lady was to be in court at a certain time it's not always so easy to say, "Oh we couldn't get her here because she was so violent." I am not defending the cops. What they did was wrong. But I think a lot of people here are way over simplifying this situation.

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Lady Gaga Snerd

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It IS the fault of the Organization for not adjusting to the realities of our times. You expect EVERY other professional from medical professionals, pilots, etc to have policies and procedures and training in place to handle situations.

And, no, nobody here is saying that they should be medical professionals or give injections. But, they should err on the side of caution. They should DE-ESCALATE situations. They don't immediately storm in when there are hostages. They examine the situation and make the best plan so as to not get the hostages killed. At least that is what we USED to expect from police. We used to expect professional diligence, caution and decision making that was clear headed and rational.

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Lady Gaga Snerd

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Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
The police are not really trained in dealing with the mentally ill. That's not the fault of the policemen. That's on the higher ups who need to have training for them. I don't put that on them at all. Someone has to set up a system to teach them about this. Because if they don't know how to recognize and deal with it they will treat her like they did. Also, in these little jails they DO NOT keep major drugs. If someone has an issue they call an ambulance and have them taken to the hospital. The police do not, and cannot, just "give a shot". Also, some of the drugs listed are no longer used unless it is absolutely life and death because many of them have been show to have severe side effects. Oh, and little known fact, giving a drug to make someone "fall over" is considered physical restraint which falls into the same category as tazing them. And when you give someone a shot it can take half and hour to an hour and a half for it to take action. If the lady was to be in court at a certain time it's not always so easy to say, "Oh we couldn't get her here because she was so violent." I am not defending the cops. What they did was wrong. But I think a lot of people here are way over simplifying this situation.

Yes, giving a drug is a chemical restraint of sorts. And, yes, only someone trained in that should do so. But, the doses of sedatives have been well studied and documented. Not sure tasering someone multiple times within seconds has been demonstrated to be safe. So, no a chemical sedative is absolutely not the same thing as tazing someone.

As for taking a half hour? So damn what? Go in , give her the injection and wait a half hour? Wow. I am in no way "simplifying this".

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Nobody Just Nobody

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I already said they needed to be trained better. So I'm not sure what more you wanted from that. But I'm a nurse. I've seen people given huge doses of Haladol and still get up and walk around and fight. There's not a magic answer here. You can't just blame one thing. This was a failure on so many levels.

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Lady Gaga Snerd

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Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I already said they needed to be trained better. So I'm not sure what more you wanted from that. But I'm a nurse. I've seen people given huge doses of Haladol and still get up and walk around and fight. There's not a magic answer here. You can't just blame one thing. This was a failure on so many levels.

Yes. I agree with you. But, I have never seen a nurse KILL a patient in this type of situation. Have you?

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Nobody Just Nobody

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I guess I read everyone saying give her drugs and I've worked with mentally ill patients before. They dump them in the nursing homes because there's no place left for them. And they don't belong there. Mentally ill patients can go from normal to beating the holy chit out of someone in a matter seconds. You won't like what I have to say but when that happened in the nursing home our goal was to keep everyone else safe. We'd call the ambulance and they'd bring a bunch of huge guys and everyone would restrain the person and they'd haul him off to the psych ward. I didn't really care what they did to them once they were not my problem.

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flan327

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Shouldn't the police at least be trained in how often to use a Tazer on a person? flan __________________ You are my sun, my moon, and all of my stars.

weltschmerz

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Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I already said they needed to be trained better. So I'm not sure what more you wanted from that. But I'm a nurse. I've seen people given huge doses of Haladol and still get up and walk around and fight. There's not a magic answer here. You can't just blame one thing. This was a failure on so many levels.

You're a nurse? You don't give Haldol if you want to subdue someone who is in the throes of violent psychosis. That won't work. You inject a sedative if you want a fast result. Later, you can start a regimen of antipsychotics like Haldol.

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flan327 wrote:
Shouldn't the police at least be trained in how often to use a Tazer on a person?

flan

Yes. They should. Did she get up between the tazings? I don't know all the details of this case. I'm kind of a fence sitter here. I DO understand some of what the police faced. I honestly do. But then also she was mentally ill and needed special-(different) treatment that someone who might have been say drunk did. And it'd just not that easy to shoot her up with a drug and two seconds later she's subdued. And what if she'd have been allergic to whatever they gave her and she died? People would be screaming bloody murder and suing the doctor. I'm not siding with the police but I also think some are really oversimplifying this.

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weltschmerz

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Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
flan327 wrote:
Shouldn't the police at least be trained in how often to use a Tazer on a person?

flan
Yes. They should. Did she get up between the tazings? I don't know all the details of this case. I'm kind of a fence sitter here. I DO understand some of what the police faced. I honestly do. But then also she was mentally ill and needed special-(different) treatment that someone who might have been say drunk did. And it'd just not that easy to shoot her up with a drug and two seconds later she's subdued. And what if she'd have been allergic to whatever they gave her and she died? People would be screaming bloody murder and suing the doctor. I'm not siding with the police but I also think some are really oversimplifying this.

It's quite rare for a person to be allergic to anxiolytics. Beats being tasered to death.

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Nobody Just Nobody

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weltschmerz wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I already said they needed to be trained better. So I'm not sure what more you wanted from that. But I'm a nurse. I've seen people given huge doses of Haladol and still get up and walk around and fight. There's not a magic answer here. You can't just blame one thing. This was a failure on so many levels.
You're a nurse? You don't give Haldol if you want to subdue someone who is in the throes of violent psychosis. That won't work. You inject a sedative if you want a fast result. Later, you can start a regimen of antipsychotics like Haldol.

Number one I haven't worked in three years. Two I worked mostly with geriatrics. I hated working with the mentally ill. Not because I hated the mentally ill but because it just wasn't my cup of tea. And no, we were not allowed to just inject a sedative. Our laws and rules here are different. Patients have to give their consent for things. I know it doesn't make sense. It's stupid and crazy. But that's the way it is. We were only allowed to give oral meds. Well, when a patient is out of control they are not going to take an oral pill. So we sent them out. I'm sure you're going to say you know so much more than me but you don't live here. We have different laws.

And I only used Haldol for an example because someone above use that for an example. Haldol and Xanax was what someone mentioned.

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lilyofcourse

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Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
The police are not really trained in dealing with the mentally ill. That's not the fault of the policemen. That's on the higher ups who need to have training for them. I don't put that on them at all. Someone has to set up a system to teach them about this. Because if they don't know how to recognize and deal with it they will treat her like they did. Also, in these little jails they DO NOT keep major drugs. If someone has an issue they call an ambulance and have them taken to the hospital. The police do not, and cannot, just "give a shot". Also, some of the drugs listed are no longer used unless it is absolutely life and death because many of them have been show to have severe side effects. Oh, and little known fact, giving a drug to make someone "fall over" is considered physical restraint which falls into the same category as tazing them. And when you give someone a shot it can take half and hour to an hour and a half for it to take action. If the lady was to be in court at a certain time it's not always so easy to say, "Oh we couldn't get her here because she was so violent." I am not defending the cops. What they did was wrong. But I think a lot of people here are way over simplifying this situation.
Yes, giving a drug is a chemical restraint of sorts. And, yes, only someone trained in that should do so. But, the doses of sedatives have been well studied and documented. Not sure tasering someone multiple times within seconds has been demonstrated to be safe. So, no a chemical sedative is absolutely not the same thing as tazing someone.

As for taking a half hour? So damn what? Go in , give her the injection and wait a half hour? Wow. I am in no way "simplifying this".

You understand that it took 5 people and 4 bolts to subdue this one woman? You're getting that, right?

She wasn't going to stand there and hold out her arm for a shot.

You seem to think she would willingly be calm and not fight that.

Don't understand how you are missing that.

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Mellow Momma

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MyNameIsJoe wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
They were in biohazard suits. There was no risk to them whatsover.
So what? They shouldn't have to put up with someone throwing PEE on them while they work. Do you have to put up with that at your job?

That's RIDICULOUS. She brought this on herself. On what planet is it somehow ok to throw your PEE???? If you do that, and some big guys in suits jump your ass and taze you--you deserved it.

This is a classic case of an oxygen bandit. Maybe she didn't exactly "deserve" to die--but the world isn't going to miss her, either.
Wow! I can't believe I'm reading this. What a cold, despicable post.
Horrible. You dare to call a human being an oxygen bandit? A human being. A HUMAN BEING. You, sir, have no idea what she has accomplished, who loved her, what she would have accomplished. Perhaps she was a mother. Perhaps she was an accomplished mathematical genius before schizophrenia claimed her mind. Perhaps she volunteered at the humane society. Perhaps she had the most beautiful garden in her neighborhood. Perhaps she gave birth to the scientist who will cure cancer. You know only a micro-fraction of her life and you dare to say she had no worth?

Thank you.

Some of the Christians here who spout such support of pro-life causes could take a lesson from this type of attitude.

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lilyofcourse

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It boggles my mind that some of ya'll want the police to take on the roles of psychiatry and doctor and mother.

The police are to keep order. Not practice medicine or in grain life lessons.

When your kid starts throwing a tantrum, do you just let them? If they start throwing things, do you just wait it out? If they hit you, do you say or do nothing?

The police shouldn't have to spend their shift dodging pissed and listening to a fit.

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lilyofcourse

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Mellow Momma wrote:
MyNameIsJoe wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
They were in biohazard suits. There was no risk to them whatsover.
So what? They shouldn't have to put up with someone throwing PEE on them while they work. Do you have to put up with that at your job?

That's RIDICULOUS. She brought this on herself. On what planet is it somehow ok to throw your PEE???? If you do that, and some big guys in suits jump your ass and taze you--you deserved it.

This is a classic case of an oxygen bandit. Maybe she didn't exactly "deserve" to die--but the world isn't going to miss her, either.
Wow! I can't believe I'm reading this. What a cold, despicable post.
Horrible. You dare to call a human being an oxygen bandit? A human being. A HUMAN BEING. You, sir, have no idea what she has accomplished, who loved her, what she would have accomplished. Perhaps she was a mother. Perhaps she was an accomplished mathematical genius before schizophrenia claimed her mind. Perhaps she volunteered at the humane society. Perhaps she had the most beautiful garden in her neighborhood. Perhaps she gave birth to the scientist who will cure cancer. You know only a micro-fraction of her life and you dare to say she had no worth?

Thank you.
Some of the Christians here who spout such support of pro-life causes could take a lesson from this type of attitude.

It doesn't matter one ioda. She was arrested because she attacked an officer.

She was treated appropriately and arrested and put in a cell.

She is the one who escalated the situation.

She earned her own outcome.

The bleed heart crap is just that. Crap.

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Nobody Just Nobody

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No Lily the bleeding heart crap is not crap. She was mentally ill. Just because you personally don't believe in mental illness doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I actually don't believe you are all that disabled. But somehow you manged to get disability. So the point is just because a lay person doesn't believe it doesn't mean it isn't so. She WAS mentally ill. It's a DISEASE! A disease recognized by doctors. The same way you got doctors to diagnose you. I don't really give a rat's azz if you don't believe it. I don't think you can just put your big girl panties on and decide not to be mentally ill. She had a serious problem. She needed help.

These cops did the best they could with the situation they had. They failed. Many things could have changed. They SHOULD have had more knowledge of the mentally ill so that they could have recognized her situation. They should not have tazed her so many times. I don't think the intent of the cops was to set out and kill her. I honestly don't think they meant to do wrong. They just didn't know how to handle the situation, it escalated, and it went horribly wrong. Now she is dead. I have sympathy for the police. But I also have sympathy for this woman who probably didn't know what the hell was going on.

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Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
No Lily the bleeding heart crap is not crap. She was mentally ill. Just because you personally don't believe in mental illness doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I actually don't believe you are all that disabled. But somehow you manged to get disability. So the point is just because a lay person doesn't believe it doesn't mean it isn't so. She WAS mentally ill. It's a DISEASE! A disease recognized by doctors. The same way you got doctors to diagnose you. I don't really give a rat's azz if you don't believe it. I don't think you can just put your big girl panties on and decide not to be mentally ill. She had a serious problem. She needed help.

These cops did the best they could with the situation they had. They failed. Many things could have changed. They SHOULD have had more knowledge of the mentally ill so that they could have recognized her situation. They should not have tazed her so many times. I don't think the intent of the cops was to set out and kill her. I honestly don't think they meant to do wrong. They just didn't know how to handle the situation, it escalated, and it went horribly wrong. Now she is dead. I have sympathy for the police. But I also have sympathy for this woman who probably didn't know what the hell was going on.

It's clear that some people are very ignorant of what mental illness is and how it effects someone's mind and body. Ignorance of mental illness doesn't mean one cannot have compassion though. And it's the lack of compassion for this poor woman that makes me glad I don't know some of you in real life. In fact, the more some people post, the more I am shocked at their ignorance. It's absolutely gobsmacking. Everyone deserves compassion. And oxygen - but I assumed that went without saying. Apparently not.

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lilyofcourse

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Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
No Lily the bleeding heart crap is not crap. She was mentally ill. Just because you personally don't believe in mental illness doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I actually don't believe you are all that disabled. But somehow you manged to get disability. So the point is just because a lay person doesn't believe it doesn't mean it isn't so. She WAS mentally ill. It's a DISEASE! A disease recognized by doctors. The same way you got doctors to diagnose you. I don't really give a rat's azz if you don't believe it. I don't think you can just put your big girl panties on and decide not to be mentally ill. She had a serious problem. She needed help.

These cops did the best they could with the situation they had. They failed. Many things could have changed. They SHOULD have had more knowledge of the mentally ill so that they could have recognized her situation. They should not have tazed her so many times. I don't think the intent of the cops was to set out and kill her. I honestly don't think they meant to do wrong. They just didn't know how to handle the situation, it escalated, and it went horribly wrong. Now she is dead. I have sympathy for the police. But I also have sympathy for this woman who probably didn't know what the hell was going on.

I don't really care what you believe.

This isn't about me.

I never said I don't believe in mental illness. I most certainly do.

I don't believe it is an excuse to attack people and throw piss.

The police don't do mental health screenings. It's not their job.

As for me and my disability, I hope and pray you never have to live the way I do. And your nasty little comment actually makes me happy that you have no clue what it is like.

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Mellow Momma

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lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
No Lily the bleeding heart crap is not crap. She was mentally ill. Just because you personally don't believe in mental illness doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I actually don't believe you are all that disabled. But somehow you manged to get disability. So the point is just because a lay person doesn't believe it doesn't mean it isn't so. She WAS mentally ill. It's a DISEASE! A disease recognized by doctors. The same way you got doctors to diagnose you. I don't really give a rat's azz if you don't believe it. I don't think you can just put your big girl panties on and decide not to be mentally ill. She had a serious problem. She needed help.

These cops did the best they could with the situation they had. They failed. Many things could have changed. They SHOULD have had more knowledge of the mentally ill so that they could have recognized her situation. They should not have tazed her so many times. I don't think the intent of the cops was to set out and kill her. I honestly don't think they meant to do wrong. They just didn't know how to handle the situation, it escalated, and it went horribly wrong. Now she is dead. I have sympathy for the police. But I also have sympathy for this woman who probably didn't know what the hell was going on.
I don't really care what you believe.
This isn't about me.
I never said I don't believe in mental illness. I most certainly do.
I don't believe it is an excuse to attack people and throw piss.
The police don't do mental health screenings. It's not their job.
As for me and my disability, I hope and pray you never have to live the way I do. And your nasty little comment actually makes me happy that you have no clue what it is like.

Just as your comments about mental illness make me happy that YOU have no clue what it's like. Because it's painfully obvious you are totally ignorant on the subject.

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Mellow Momma

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And actually the police DO perform mental health screenings as part of the intake process. They ask specific questions to determine the person's state of mind, likelihood of harming themselves, etc. __________________ Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite !

lilyofcourse

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How much compassion?

MM, NJN. I asked Gaga. She never really answered. Maybe you can.

Do you think they went in that cell with the intention of killing her?

What should they have done?

Of course, like Gaga, you have the benefit of hind sight.

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Nobody Just Nobody

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I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.

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lilyofcourse

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Mellow Momma wrote:
And actually the police DO perform mental health screenings as part of the intake process. They ask specific questions to determine the person's state of mind, likelihood of harming themselves, etc.

If you say so.

Waiting for your answer. Do you think they went in to kill her?

And what about those who fake crazy?

It's so easy to armchair quarterback.

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lilyofcourse

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Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.

Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.

But oh well.

As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

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Mellow Momma

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Up thread, I listed the things I wish they would have done. Go back and read.

No, I do not think their intent was to kill her. That doesn't make it right or ok that they did though. Just like the boys in throwing a rock off a bridge thread, what they did led to terrible consequences and they should be punished for it. Unlike the boys though, these were adults at work with training and procedures to follow and dangerous weapons at heir disposal. They didn't follow their procedures, I guarantee it. And they didn't use their training. They are taught to de-escalate situations such as this. They failed. Big time.

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Nobody Just Nobody

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You are apparently unable to read. In almost every post I said the police had no intentions of killing her. As to what SHOULD have happened? This incident had no good answer. What SHOULD have happened should have started years ago by educating the police on mental illness. I don't think there was a cut and dry answer for this. You seem to read into my post that I am siding with one or the other. I have reapeatedly said I am not. So you are apparently unable to read.

It's not that hard to figure out who is faking crazy and who is faking being sick.

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“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Mellow Momma wrote:
Up thread, I listed the things I wish they would have done. Go back and read.

No, I do not think their intent was to kill her. That doesn't make it right or ok that they did though. Just like the boys in throwing a rock off a bridge thread, what they did led to terrible consequences and they should be punished for it. Unlike the boys though, these were adults at work with training and procedures to follow and dangerous weapons at heir disposal. They didn't follow their procedures, I guarantee it. And they didn't use their training. They are taught to de-escalate situations such as this. They failed. Big time.

And you listed what they "should have" done because you have the benefit of all the facts AFTER the incident.

That's the point. In the moment, they did what they knew to do.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

Mellow Momma

Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline

Posts: 7536

Date: Sep 12, 2015

lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Their job was to keep her safe. Not to kill her.

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite !

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
You are apparently unable to read. In almost every post I said the police had no intentions of killing her. As to what SHOULD have happened? This incident had no good answer. What SHOULD have happened should have started years ago by educating the police on mental illness. I don't think there was a cut and dry answer for this. You seem to read into my post that I am siding with one or the other. I have reapeatedly said I am not. So you are apparently unable to read.

It's not that hard to figure out who is faking crazy and who is faking being sick.

And you are doing the same.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

Nobody Just Nobody

Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline

Posts: 24026

Date: Sep 12, 2015

lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Well, I will remember not to post anything about my life so I don't steal the spotlight from you! We certainly don't want THAT to happen.

I posted about my dog. That's the only thing I posted about lately. OMG that's so horrible. I'm sorry my dog's health overshadowed your attention.

__________________

“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Their job was to keep her safe. Not to kill her.

No. Their job was to arrest and hold a criminal. And when the criminal was not compliant, their job was to restrain her to keep her from hurting herself and being destructive.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

	Permalink
They were trying to keep her safe from herself. __________________ A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo. Charley Harper

Nobody Just Nobody

Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline

Posts: 24026

Date: Sep 12, 2015

lilyofcourse wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Their job was to keep her safe. Not to kill her.
No. Their job was to arrest and hold a criminal. And when the criminal was not compliant, their job was to restrain her to keep her from hurting herself and being destructive.

NOT TO KILL HER!

__________________

“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou

Mellow Momma

Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline

Posts: 7536

Date: Sep 12, 2015

lilyofcourse wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
Up thread, I listed the things I wish they would have done. Go back and read.

No, I do not think their intent was to kill her. That doesn't make it right or ok that they did though. Just like the boys in throwing a rock off a bridge thread, what they did led to terrible consequences and they should be punished for it. Unlike the boys though, these were adults at work with training and procedures to follow and dangerous weapons at heir disposal. They didn't follow their procedures, I guarantee it. And they didn't use their training. They are taught to de-escalate situations such as this. They failed. Big time.
And you listed what they "should have" done because you have the benefit of all the facts AFTER the incident.
That's the point. In the moment, they did what they knew to do.

No they didn't. They ignored procedure and repeatedly tazed her. That isn't right in any situation. If it doesnt work, it doesn't magically start working if you do it again and again.

Someone in that situation should have taken charge and suggested a different course of action. But that's a huge problem with the police - in my opinion. They won't stand up to each other and tell a fellow officer to stop doing something that is wrong.

__________________

Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite !

Mellow Momma

Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Status: Offline

Posts: 7536

Date: Sep 12, 2015

	Permalink
The ignorance and lack of compassion on this thread is offensive. I am done with this thread. __________________ Out of all the lies I have told, "just kidding" is my favorite !

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Well, I will remember not to post anything about my life so I don't steal the spotlight from you! We certainly don't want THAT to happen.
I posted about my dog. That's the only thing I posted about lately. OMG that's so horrible. I'm sorry my dog's health overshadowed your attention.

No. There is always some kind of drama for you.

And I'm not really posting like I once did.

So.....

Carry on.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Their job was to keep her safe. Not to kill her.
No. Their job was to arrest and hold a criminal. And when the criminal was not compliant, their job was to restrain her to keep her from hurting herself and being destructive.
NOT TO KILL HER!

AGAIN, WAS IT THEIR INTENT ?

See, I can yell too.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

Nobody Just Nobody

Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline

Posts: 24026

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Well, I have the right to post whatever the fvck I want and I will continue to do so. Thank god you are NOT a moderator. If I want to post about my toe nails I will. I don't give a rat's azz if you think I post too much drama. I do NOT always have drama but yeah, my dog did have a seizure. Remind if your dog gets run over or something to say you have no right to post about it.

You have so little compassion for someone so righteous.

__________________

“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
Up thread, I listed the things I wish they would have done. Go back and read.

No, I do not think their intent was to kill her. That doesn't make it right or ok that they did though. Just like the boys in throwing a rock off a bridge thread, what they did led to terrible consequences and they should be punished for it. Unlike the boys though, these were adults at work with training and procedures to follow and dangerous weapons at heir disposal. They didn't follow their procedures, I guarantee it. And they didn't use their training. They are taught to de-escalate situations such as this. They failed. Big time.
And you listed what they "should have" done because you have the benefit of all the facts AFTER the incident.
That's the point. In the moment, they did what they knew to do.
No they didn't. They ignored procedure and repeatedly tazed her. That isn't right in any situation. If it doesnt work, it doesn't magically start working if you do it again and again.
Someone in that situation should have taken charge and suggested a different course of action. But that's a huge problem with the police - in my opinion. They won't stand up to each other and tell a fellow officer to stop doing something that is wrong.

How do you know they did not follow procedure? Because you Googled?

They did their job.

The outcome was unforseen.

Can they learn from this? Yes.

Are they heartless killers? No.

They are police.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

Nobody Just Nobody

Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline

Posts: 24026

Date: Sep 12, 2015

lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Their job was to keep her safe. Not to kill her.
No. Their job was to arrest and hold a criminal. And when the criminal was not compliant, their job was to restrain her to keep her from hurting herself and being destructive.
NOT TO KILL HER!
AGAIN, WAS IT THEIR INTENT ?
See, I can yell too.

You need to go back to kindergarten because I have said in almost every post I wrote that that wasn't their intention. But she's still dead. So that means something went wrong. I have explained all this multiple times to you and you just refuse to read what I posted. I will not repeat it again.

__________________

“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
Well, I have the right to post whatever the fvck I want and I will continue to do so. Thank god you are NOT a moderator. If I want to post about my toe nails I will. I don't give a rat's azz if you think I post too much drama. I do NOT always have drama but yeah, my dog did have a seizure. Remind if your dog gets run over or something to say you have no right to post about it.

You have so little compassion for someone so righteous.

Remember YOU made this personal. Not me.

I said I don't care what you post.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Their job was to keep her safe. Not to kill her.
No. Their job was to arrest and hold a criminal. And when the criminal was not compliant, their job was to restrain her to keep her from hurting herself and being destructive.
NOT TO KILL HER!
AGAIN, WAS IT THEIR INTENT ?
See, I can yell too.
You need to go back to kindergarten because I have said in almost every post I wrote that that wasn't their intention. But she's still dead. So that means something went wrong. I have explained all this multiple times to you and you just refuse to read what I posted. I will not repeat it again.

What is with you and the personal insults?

As for the op, yes, you do keep saying it. But it doesn't change anything.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

Nobody Just Nobody

Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline

Posts: 24026

Date: Sep 12, 2015

lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
Well, I have the right to post whatever the fvck I want and I will continue to do so. Thank god you are NOT a moderator. If I want to post about my toe nails I will. I don't give a rat's azz if you think I post too much drama. I do NOT always have drama but yeah, my dog did have a seizure. Remind if your dog gets run over or something to say you have no right to post about it.

You have so little compassion for someone so righteous.
Remember YOU made this personal. Not me.
I said I don't care what you post.

No Lily, don't start this I'm all innocent act. You started it off by saying I am constantly posting drama. I do not. Not any more than anyone else on this board. And even if I DID that is my right as long as I follow the rules. And you obviously DO care because you keep posting over and over and over about all MY posts.

__________________

“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou

Nobody Just Nobody

Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Status: Offline

Posts: 24026

Date: Sep 12, 2015

lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Their job was to keep her safe. Not to kill her.
No. Their job was to arrest and hold a criminal. And when the criminal was not compliant, their job was to restrain her to keep her from hurting herself and being destructive.
NOT TO KILL HER!
AGAIN, WAS IT THEIR INTENT ?
See, I can yell too.
You need to go back to kindergarten because I have said in almost every post I wrote that that wasn't their intention. But she's still dead. So that means something went wrong. I have explained all this multiple times to you and you just refuse to read what I posted. I will not repeat it again.
What is with you and the personal insults?
As for the op, yes, you do keep saying it. But it doesn't change anything.

First you said I didn't say it and now you said I did say it but it doesn't matter that I said it. Good lord you can't even keep up with yourself. I'm done.

__________________

“You may shoot me with your words, you may cut me with your eyes, you may kill me with your hatefulness, but still, like air, I'll rise!”
― Maya Angelou

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
Well, I have the right to post whatever the fvck I want and I will continue to do so. Thank god you are NOT a moderator. If I want to post about my toe nails I will. I don't give a rat's azz if you think I post too much drama. I do NOT always have drama but yeah, my dog did have a seizure. Remind if your dog gets run over or something to say you have no right to post about it.

You have so little compassion for someone so righteous.
Remember YOU made this personal. Not me.
I said I don't care what you post.

No Lily, don't start this I'm all innocent act. You started it off by saying I am constantly posting drama. I do not. Not any more than anyone else on this board. And even if I DID that is my right as long as I follow the rules. And you obviously DO care because you keep posting over and over and over about all MY posts.

No. You started with the personal insult about my disability and not believing it.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
No Lily the bleeding heart crap is not crap. She was mentally ill. Just because you personally don't believe in mental illness doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I actually don't believe you are all that disabled. But somehow you manged to get disability. So the point is just because a lay person doesn't believe it doesn't mean it isn't so. She WAS mentally ill. It's a DISEASE! A disease recognized by doctors. The same way you got doctors to diagnose you. I don't really give a rat's azz if you don't believe it. I don't think you can just put your big girl panties on and decide not to be mentally ill. She had a serious problem. She needed help.

These cops did the best they could with the situation they had. They failed. Many things could have changed. They SHOULD have had more knowledge of the mentally ill so that they could have recognized her situation. They should not have tazed her so many times. I don't think the intent of the cops was to set out and kill her. I honestly don't think they meant to do wrong. They just didn't know how to handle the situation, it escalated, and it went horribly wrong. Now she is dead. I have sympathy for the police. But I also have sympathy for this woman who probably didn't know what the hell was going on.

In case you want to try to play innocent yourself.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

lilyofcourse

My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Status: Offline

Posts: 38325

Date: Sep 12, 2015

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I actually do have issues. I just choose not to make them my daily cross to die on. I don't have to post about them on a daily basis.

This woman was mentally ill. Ignorance of mental illness is no excuse for lack of compassion. This woman most likely had no idea what she was doing or why. What she did was wrong. 100% wrong. But she was not a belligerent drunk. The problem in this situation was the police treated her like a belligerent drunk. Because see, if you're drunk you can sleep it off. You don't sleep off mental illness. The police did not approach this situation correctly. But they also didn't know any better. It was a situation that was bound to go wrong.
Oh you do post about the horrors of your life daily. Take over threads talking about them.
But oh well.
As for the op, I have only maintained that the police acted accordingly. That they were doing their job.

Their job was to keep her safe. Not to kill her.
No. Their job was to arrest and hold a criminal. And when the criminal was not compliant, their job was to restrain her to keep her from hurting herself and being destructive.
NOT TO KILL HER!
AGAIN, WAS IT THEIR INTENT ?
See, I can yell too.
You need to go back to kindergarten because I have said in almost every post I wrote that that wasn't their intention. But she's still dead. So that means something went wrong. I have explained all this multiple times to you and you just refuse to read what I posted. I will not repeat it again.
What is with you and the personal insults?
As for the op, yes, you do keep saying it. But it doesn't change anything.

First you said I didn't say it and now you said I did say it but it doesn't matter that I said it. Good lord you can't even keep up with yourself. I'm done.

Actually, no. I never did say that.

__________________

A flock of flirting flamingos is pure, passionate, pink pandemonium-a frenetic flamingle-mangle-a discordant discotheque of delirious dancing, flamboyant feathers, and flamingo lingo.

weltschmerz

Guru

Status: Offline

Posts: 4882

Date: Sep 12, 2015

	Permalink
lilyofcourse wrote: They were trying to keep her safe from herself. Well, they certainly did a bang-up job of that, didn't they? I'm out as well. I can't stand the utter heartlessness in here. I feel like a need a bath to wash the stink off. __________________

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