TOTALLY GEEKED!

weltschmerz · Guru

RE: Do You Believe in the Devil?

Ohfour · Hooker

Wow...so sad that you dont think of your son as a miracle. I feel sad for both of you. Especially him, that his own mother doesnt appreciate the miracle that he is...

Poor guy...

weltschmerz · Guru

Ohfour wrote:
Wow...so sad that you dont think of your son as a miracle. I feel sad for both of you. Especially him, that his own mother doesnt appreciate the miracle that he is...

Poor guy...

What on earth makes you think I don't appreciate him? I just don't think there was any '"divine intervention" involved.

What an odd thing to say!

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

weltschmerz wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Weltz, can you prove God and Satan DOESN'T exist?
You're asking me to prove a negative? Seriously?
Look, if someone posts that there is TONS of evidence that God is real, let's see some.

So you are saying you can't disprove their existence?

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

weltschmerz wrote:
Want to show me a real miracle? Show me someone who had a limb grow back after prayer. People lose limbs all the time, from war or accidents or diabetes.
Everything else can be explained.

So you want something to come from nothing.

That is what you call a miracle.

But you completely dismiss creation.

Do I have this right?

Ohfour · Hooker

weltschmerz wrote:
Ohfour wrote:
Wow...so sad that you dont think of your son as a miracle. I feel sad for both of you. Especially him, that his own mother doesnt appreciate the miracle that he is...

Poor guy...
What on earth makes you think I don't appreciate him? I just don't think there was any '"divine intervention" involved.
What an odd thing to say!

You think you made him what he is? God did. Despite you....

weltschmerz · Guru

lilyofcourse wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Weltz, can you prove God and Satan DOESN'T exist?
You're asking me to prove a negative? Seriously?
Look, if someone posts that there is TONS of evidence that God is real, let's see some.
So you are saying you can't disprove their existence?

I can't prove a negative, no. It's a logical fallacy.

weltschmerz · Guru

Prove to me that the Invisible Pink Unicorn doesn't exist. Go on, prove it.
The burden of proof lies with the one making the claim.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

weltschmerz wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Weltz, can you prove God and Satan DOESN'T exist?
You're asking me to prove a negative? Seriously?
Look, if someone posts that there is TONS of evidence that God is real, let's see some.
So you are saying you can't disprove their existence?
I can't prove a negative, no. It's a logical fallacy.

So you can't disprove God or Satan.

If you can't disprove, logically, that leaves room for the possibility they are both real.

Now, I have a book with eyewitness accounts to the miracles of God.

I think that means there is more evidence to support my side than yours.

Therefore, you can not just say "oh God isn't real" because you can't prove it.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

weltschmerz wrote:
Prove to me that the Invisible Pink Unicorn doesn't exist. Go on, prove it.
The burden of proof lies with the one making the claim.

Do you have proof that it does?

Now unicorns are mentioned in the Bible.

It doesn't say what color it is. And since it is an elusive creature that more than likely died during the flood, I don't know if it could camouflage or make its self "invisible".

So again, I have more proof that it does, or did, exist than you have that it didnt.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Bible search results

Numbers 23:22

God brought them out of Egypt; he hath as it were the strength of an unicorn.

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Numbers 24:8

God brought him forth out of Egypt; he hath as it were the strength of an unicorn: he shall eat up the nations his enemies, and shall break their bones, and pierce them through with his arrows.

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Deuteronomy 33:17

His glory is like the firstling of his bullock, and his horns are like the horns of unicorns: with them he shall push the people together to the ends of the earth: and they are the ten thousands of Ephraim, and they are the thousands of Manasseh.

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Job 39:9

Will the unicorn be willing to serve thee, or abide by thy crib?

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Job 39:10

Canst thou bind the unicorn with his band in the furrow? or will he harrow the valleys after thee?

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Psalm 22:21

Save me from the lion's mouth: for thou hast heard me from the horns of the unicorns.

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Psalm 29:6

He maketh them also to skip like a calf; Lebanon and Sirion like a young unicorn.

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Psalm 92:10

But my horn shalt thou exalt like the horn of an unicorn: I shall be anointed with fresh oil.

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Isaiah 34:7

And the unicorns shall come down with them, and the bullocks with the bulls; and their land shall be soaked with blood, and their dust made fat with fatness.

In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

huskerbb · Guru

weltschmerz wrote:
Prove to me that the Invisible Pink Unicorn doesn't exist. Go on, prove it.
The burden of proof lies with the one making the claim.

You are making the claim that he doesn't exist. That is pretty much what the article is saying. Prove it.

weltschmerz · Guru

lilyofcourse wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
Prove to me that the Invisible Pink Unicorn doesn't exist. Go on, prove it.
The burden of proof lies with the one making the claim.
Do you have proof that it does?
Now unicorns are mentioned in the Bible.
It doesn't say what color it is. And since it is an elusive creature that more than likely died during the flood, I don't know if it could camouflage or make its self "invisible".
So again, I have more proof that it does, or did, exist than you have that it didnt.

I never claimed that the Invisible Pink Unicorn exists. Not once. However, if I did, the onus would be on me to prove it, not for you to disprove it. How would you go about disproving it anyway, pray tell? How?

You clearly never took any Logic classes in school.

-- Edited by weltschmerz on Monday 28th of September 2015 11:05:38 PM

-- Edited by weltschmerz on Monday 28th of September 2015 11:14:57 PM

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

weltschmerz wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
Prove to me that the Invisible Pink Unicorn doesn't exist. Go on, prove it.
The burden of proof lies with the one making the claim.
Do you have proof that it does?
Now unicorns are mentioned in the Bible.
It doesn't say what color it is. And since it is an elusive creature that more than likely died during the flood, I don't know if it could camouflage or make its self "invisible".
So again, I have more proof that it does, or did, exist than you have that it didnt.
I never claimed that the Invisible Pink Unicorn exists. Not once. However, if I did, the onus would be on me to prove it, not for you do disprove it. How would you go about disproving it anyway, pray tell? How?
You clearly never took any Logics classes in school.

You can't disprove Satan exists. You can't disprove God exists.

I have a book of eyewitness accounts to God's miracles and existence.

And this book give an account of how Lucifer became Satan.

You want me to offer proof. Well. There it is.

Now.

You show me proof to the contrary.

weltschmerz · Guru

Anecdotes aren't empirical evidence. You have a book of anecdotes, much like books with stories of being abducted by flying saucers or Bigfoot encounters.
Again...want to show me a miracle? Have a limb grow back after prayer. Put it in the New England Journal of Medicine.
I'll be most happy to reconsider my position.

huskerbb · Guru

Your refusal to believe is pretty much proof of his existence. That is certainly what he wants you to believe.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

weltschmerz wrote:
Anecdotes aren't empirical evidence. You have a book of anecdotes, much like books with stories of being abducted by flying saucers or Bigfoot encounters.
Again...want to show me a miracle? Have a limb grow back after prayer. Put it in the New England Journal of Medicine.
I'll be most happy to reconsider my position.

So what you are saying is you have no proof that neither God nor Satan exists.

And you want to dismiss a book relating eyewitness accounts that is over 2000 years old and in the making.

Ok.

So while I have something, you have nothing.

That means, in the scientific community, that I have more proof that they do exist and therefore it can be concluded that they do.

Nothing more to say on the subject.

God is real. Satan is real.

weltschmerz · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
Your refusal to believe is pretty much proof of his existence. That is certainly what he wants you to believe.

Do you believe in the Tooth Fairy? Your refusal to believe is proof of her existence.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Weltz - I don't have a problem with you choosing not to believe, but your utter disdain for those that do is disturbing, disrespectful, and downright wrong.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

weltschmerz wrote:
Anecdotes aren't empirical evidence. You have a book of anecdotes, much like books with stories of being abducted by flying saucers or Bigfoot encounters.
Again...want to show me a miracle? Have a limb grow back after prayer. Put it in the New England Journal of Medicine.
I'll be most happy to reconsider my position.

Thank you!

flan

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

chef wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
So, it seems like as soon as you ask for proof or evidence, everyone disappears.
There is no proof. There never was.
It would not matter what proof or evidence is provided. You will refute and deny it until you are ready to open your heart to Christ.
Fact is, your heart is hardened to God. He could stand right in front of you and you would deny that He is God. When you are ready to open your heart, you will see the proof and evidence because it is all around you.

It's not about the heart, it's about the mind & the ability to reason.

flan

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

weltschmerz wrote:

Prove to me that the Invisible Pink Unicorn doesn't exist. Go on, prove it.

The burden of proof lies with the one making the claim.

No, not really. YOu are making the incredulous claim that God cannot exist ANYWHERE , at any place, on any level. So, your position is quite off. You can be unsure or just say you don't care if there is God one way or the other. But, you cannot have assurance as an atheist that God does not exist.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

flan327 wrote:

chef wrote:
weltschmerz wrote:
So, it seems like as soon as you ask for proof or evidence, everyone disappears.
There is no proof. There never was.
It would not matter what proof or evidence is provided. You will refute and deny it until you are ready to open your heart to Christ.
Fact is, your heart is hardened to God. He could stand right in front of you and you would deny that He is God. When you are ready to open your heart, you will see the proof and evidence because it is all around you.
It's not about the heart, it's about the mind & the ability to reason.
flan

King James Bible
For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

2 Timothy 1:7

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

God wants us to reason. God created reason. The existence of all that IS, is reason. To accept that it was some random cosmic episode where nothing arose from something and nonlife created LIfe is patently absurd to any reasoned person.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

weltschmerz wrote:

Want to show me a real miracle? Show me someone who had a limb grow back after prayer. People lose limbs all the time, from war or accidents or diabetes.

Everything else can be explained.

There are many miracles. Christ rising from the dead. There were hundreds of eyewitnesses to his Resurrection. THe fact that Israel still exists after the turmoil over the centuries is a miracle in of itself.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

God Incarnate coming to Earth and walking among men is a miracle. The reality is that there is no miracle that would be "proof". There is nothing that God could do that you simply would not explain away.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Eyewitness accounts ARE evidence. Non-believers choose to just discount that completely. Luke was a brilliant, well-respected doctor and he wrote an entire eye-witness account of Jesus death, burial and resurrection.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Once the nonbelievers start throwing out the tooth fairy and asking about unicorns, they realize they have nothing else.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Yes. There is substance to Christianity. Jesus Christ Himself. The Apostles. The Bible. The evidence of Creation. Historical evidence, etc. But, oh well, never mind that! Lol.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Lily - it's hard to have to give up. But these non-believers are not your mission. They have been given the opportunity to know God and purposely turned away. You are wasting your typing.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Lawyerlady wrote:
Lily - it's hard to have to give up. But these non-believers are not your mission. They have been given the opportunity to know God and purposely turned away. You are wasting your typing.

I know I will not change a single one of their minds.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

It isn't up to us to "change their minds". We can plant the seed. Only God can give the increase.

FNW · Guru

I've always believed. And I've seen. But I pay attention to my surroundings, so perhaps that's why I've seen things. I also believe in planetary pulls and forces that make things happen. Whether that's God moving the universe in such a way to make things happen, I don't know. Maybe it's a little of both, orbital pull and God's work.

huskerbb · Guru

weltschmerz wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Your refusal to believe is pretty much proof of his existence. That is certainly what he wants you to believe.
Do you believe in the Tooth Fairy? Your refusal to believe is proof of her existence.

More words that Satan would have you say.

Dona Worry Be Happy · Vette's SS!!

I have often wondered why the devil is allowed such a strong presence in the world if he is merely a fallen angel. I mean, why is he supposedly so strong--obviously, stronger than God if he can influence all of the bad and evil in the world.
If the devil is what made baby Brianna's parents and brother rape and beat her and crush I'm her skull when she was only 18 months old, why would God allow a mere fallen angel to have that kind of influence?
That sort of thing has always been my sticking point. If God and the Devil truly did exist, God would have a lot of explaining to do.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Dona Worry Be Happy wrote:
I have often wondered why the devil is allowed such a strong presence in the world if he is merely a fallen angel. I mean, why is he supposedly so strong--obviously, stronger than God if he can influence all of the bad and evil in the world.
If the devil is what made baby Brianna's parents and brother rape and beat her and crush I'm her skull when she was only 18 months old, why would God allow a mere fallen angel to have that kind of influence?
That sort of thing has always been my sticking point. If God and the Devil truly did exist, God would have a lot of explaining to do.

He is not stronger than God. He can be overcome with faith and obediece to God. He is stronger than those without faith, however, and that is why he has such a strong presence in the world.

People who blame God for "allowing" things to happen have forgotten that his biggest gift to us is free will so that we are not merely his puppets. God will use us if we are faithful and open to being used, but he does not overcome our free will.

People choose who will use them.

huskerbb · Guru

God told mankind what not to do at the beginning of creation. Man chose to listen to the devil--and we still are. That's not Gods doing.

The devil may take over someone's heart, but that's not an excuse for what they do. They are choosing to follow that rather than God.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

And I don't know what this "stronger than God" is.

Just the name Jesus said in Faith will send Satan running.

ed11563 · Guru

I kind of wish that there WAS (is) a Devil.

How many people could one Devil influence at a time? Say, 5 or 10 minutes per person per day,

not very many people.

There is WAY too much evil activity from WAY too many people for that to be what's happening.

The new recruits to ISIS every day would be way too time consuming for one Devil.

Lindley · Guru

Dona Worry Be Happy wrote:
I have often wondered why the devil is allowed such a strong presence in the world if he is merely a fallen angel. I mean, why is he supposedly so strong--obviously, stronger than God if he can influence all of the bad and evil in the world.
If the devil is what made baby Brianna's parents and brother rape and beat her and crush I'm her skull when she was only 18 months old, why would God allow a mere fallen angel to have that kind of influence?
That sort of thing has always been my sticking point. If God and the Devil truly did exist, God would have a lot of explaining to do.

God gave us free will. When God created man He gave them dominion over the earth, when Adam and eve listen to the serpent (satan) and disobeyed God by eating the forbidden fruit man forfeited his control and gave it to satsn. Sin came into the world.

If you read the Bible where Jesus was tempted by satan, when satan said if you bow down to me I will give you my kingdoms Jesus did not correct him.

As far as being stronger, in Revelation only one angel came down to bind satan.

L

huskerbb · Guru

ed11563 wrote:
I kind of wish that there WAS (is) a Devil.
How many people could one Devil influence at a time? Say, 5 or 10 minutes per person per day,

not very many people.
There is WAY too much evil activity from WAY too many people for that to be what's happening.
The new recruits to ISIS every day would be way too time consuming for one Devil.

How many people can the devil influence at one time? Billions, or more.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

ed11563 wrote:
I kind of wish that there WAS (is) a Devil.
How many people could one Devil influence at a time? Say, 5 or 10 minutes per person per day,

not very many people.
There is WAY too much evil activity from WAY too many people for that to be what's happening.
The new recruits to ISIS every day would be way too time consuming for one Devil.

The Devil has his own recruits.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Ed. 1/3 of the Heavenly host fell with him.

He has plenty of fingers to get into plenty of pies.

God and Satan ARE real.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

lilyofcourse wrote:
Ed. 1/3 of the Heavenly host fell with him.

He has plenty of fingers to get into plenty of pies.

God and Satan ARE real.

And I am free to believe otherwise.

flan

huskerbb · Guru

flan327 wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Ed. 1/3 of the Heavenly host fell with him.

He has plenty of fingers to get into plenty of pies.

God and Satan ARE real.
And I am free to believe otherwise.
flan

Sure--but you are wrong.

ed11563 · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Ed. 1/3 of the Heavenly host fell with him.

He has plenty of fingers to get into plenty of pies.

God and Satan ARE real.
And I am free to believe otherwise.
flan
Sure--but you are wrong.

You're entitled to your opinion.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

ed11563 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Ed. 1/3 of the Heavenly host fell with him.

He has plenty of fingers to get into plenty of pies.

God and Satan ARE real.
And I am free to believe otherwise.
flan
Sure--but you are wrong.
You're entitled to your opinion.

YOu wouldn't know that based upon the comments of the anti-theists.

huskerbb · Guru

ed11563 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
Ed. 1/3 of the Heavenly host fell with him.

He has plenty of fingers to get into plenty of pies.

God and Satan ARE real.
And I am free to believe otherwise.
flan
Sure--but you are wrong.
You're entitled to your opinion.

Not according to the article.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

flan327 wrote:

lilyofcourse wrote:
Ed. 1/3 of the Heavenly host fell with him.

He has plenty of fingers to get into plenty of pies.

God and Satan ARE real.
And I am free to believe otherwise.
flan

So, you don't believe in either God or Satan?

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Dona Worry Be Happy wrote:

I have often wondered why the devil is allowed such a strong presence in the world if he is merely a fallen angel. I mean, why is he supposedly so strong--obviously, stronger than God if he can influence all of the bad and evil in the world.

If the devil is what made baby Brianna's parents and brother rape and beat her and crush I'm her skull when she was only 18 months old, why would God allow a mere fallen angel to have that kind of influence?

That sort of thing has always been my sticking point. If God and the Devil truly did exist, God would have a lot of explaining to do.

He did explain it. In the Bible.