TOTALLY GEEKED!

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

The Unparented Child

huskerbb · Guru

Oh brother. More "I suck at life so it must be all my parents' fault" nonsense.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Dr. husker has spoken!

flan

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Oh good grief. Being a helicopter parent is bad, being a hands-off parent is bad, being a parent that likes to do anything besides spend hours reading stories to their kids is bad. Parents are people and therefore not perfect. Deal with the circumstances you are given and quit whining about how your life sucks because your parents were not perfect.

Tinydancer · Guru

Many who have had the worst childhoods have gone on to be extremely successful, very happy people. Sometimes life sucks but once you are an adult it's on you to create the life you want. Wallowing in the past and continuing to play the victim isn't going to make your life better. Taking charge of your own happiness is the only thing that will.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

LOL! YOu guys are Hardcore!

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
LOL! YOu guys are Hardcore!

My best friend had a raging alcoholic narcissist for a mother, and an alcoholic, enabling stepfather. He he had to work in high school to keep the damn lights in the house on they spent so much money on booze.

He is just starting to build a half million dollar house.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

In my experience, the more a person had to do for themselves as a child, the better prepared they are for the world.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
LOL! YOu guys are Hardcore!
My best friend had a raging alcoholic narcissist for a mother, and an alcoholic, enabling stepfather. He he had to work in high school to keep the damn lights in the house on they spent so much money on booze.

He is just starting to build a half million dollar house.

And for every story like that, there are hundreds of ones that don't have a happy ending.

flan

-- Edited by flan327 on Saturday 21st of November 2015 11:19:15 AM

huskerbb · Guru

flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
LOL! YOu guys are Hardcore!
My best friend had a raging alcoholic narcissist for a mother, and an alcoholic, enabling stepfather. He he had to work in high school to keep the damn lights in the house on they spent so much money on booze.

He is just starting to build a half million dollar house.
And for every story like that, there are hundreds of one that don't have a happy ending.
flan

But truly, once you are an adult, whose fault is that? If one or ten can do it, it means everyone, or at least a lot more, CAN--they just dont, and a big part of the reason is that they wallow in self pity instead of concentrating on what they can do NOW to better their situation.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Here's my take. If you are 18 and your life is a mess, you can blame your parents. If you are 40 and your life is a mess that is on You.

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Here's my take. If you are 18 and your life is a mess, you can blame your parents. If you are 40 and your life is a mess that is on You.

I mostly agree with that. By age 25 or so if you haven't at least turned some corner and taken responsibility for your own situation, it is much more on you than anyone else.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

I know someone who is 60+ but whines about his teachers from grade school. He is barely a literate reader and he blames his grade school teachers. Back in his day, reading problems weren't so recognized but so what? YOu are a grown arse man. You could have done any number of things such as hiring a personal tutor or taking classes or whatever. Instead, it is incessant whining about how he was treated in grade school. Ridiculous.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

My SIL constantly beitches, moans and whines about everything. If you spend a couple of hours with her, you will learn everything bad that ever happened in her life. I mean, seriously, has nothing good ever happened in your entire life? Wow.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Geez, I was not only an unparented child, I had to be a parent to my little sister. But, good grief, people - if I wallowed in that forever, how would that make me happy? The only way to overcome it is to do better for yourself, not bitterly continue to look back.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

How does wallowing in self pity change anything? Nothing will undo the past. It's over. Live for today and tomorrow. If you spend your life wallowing over the bad stuff, then the bad stuff has power over you for your entire life. Why do it?

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Part of growing up and being an Adult is realizing that your parents were flawed people who had their own personal issues and demons too.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

And some people are too selfish to be parents.

flan

huskerbb · Guru

flan327 wrote:
And some people are too selfish to be parents.

flan

No doubt--and that can certainly mean a crappy childhood--but it doesn't have to mean a crappy adulthood unless you let it.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
And some people are too selfish to be parents.

flan
No doubt--and that can certainly mean a crappy childhood--but it doesn't have to mean a crappy adulthood unless you let it.

I agree, but some people take longer to get over it than others.

flan

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

So then live in misery for the rest of your life? Why? ALLOW yourself some happiness.

just Czech · Give Me Grand's!

Good gosh, life decisions are a choice you make. Stop blaming someone else for your "issues".

I am so tired of the "victimhood" attitude that lasts a lifetime. Grow up and take responsibility for your own freaking stupid decisions. No one held a gun to your head and force you to be stupid.

Get help. Make better choices. Leave your past behind and move forward positively.

It IS a choice.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

just Czech wrote:
Good gosh, life decisions are a choice you make. Stop blaming someone else for your "issues".

I am so tired of the "victimhood" attitude that lasts a lifetime. Grow up and take responsibility for your own freaking stupid decisions. No one held a gun to your head and force you to be stupid.

Get help. Make better choices. Leave your past behind and move forward positively.

It IS a choice.

I did get help, but it took a long time for me to believe that I wasn't what my mother insisted I was...

flan

Lindley · Guru

flan327 wrote:
just Czech wrote:
Good gosh, life decisions are a choice you make. Stop blaming someone else for your "issues".

I am so tired of the "victimhood" attitude that lasts a lifetime. Grow up and take responsibility for your own freaking stupid decisions. No one held a gun to your head and force you to be stupid.

Get help. Make better choices. Leave your past behind and move forward positively.

It IS a choice.
I did get help, but it took a long time for me to believe that I wasn't what my mother insisted I was...
flan

Flan be proud of the fact you did do something with your life and raised two young men and have a awesome career. That took gumption.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

flan327 wrote:

just Czech wrote:
Good gosh, life decisions are a choice you make. Stop blaming someone else for your "issues".

I am so tired of the "victimhood" attitude that lasts a lifetime. Grow up and take responsibility for your own freaking stupid decisions. No one held a gun to your head and force you to be stupid.

Get help. Make better choices. Leave your past behind and move forward positively.

It IS a choice.
I did get help, but it took a long time for me to believe that I wasn't what my mother insisted I was...
flan

Yes, but here you are. Nobody said it wouldn't take time. But, like I said, if you remain stuck in that all of your life, what did you accomplish except sacrifice your entire life for someone who didn't even care about you.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lindley wrote:
flan327 wrote:
just Czech wrote:
Good gosh, life decisions are a choice you make. Stop blaming someone else for your "issues".

I am so tired of the "victimhood" attitude that lasts a lifetime. Grow up and take responsibility for your own freaking stupid decisions. No one held a gun to your head and force you to be stupid.

Get help. Make better choices. Leave your past behind and move forward positively.

It IS a choice.
I did get help, but it took a long time for me to believe that I wasn't what my mother insisted I was...
flan
Flan be proud of the fact you did do something with your life and raised two young men and have a awesome career. That took gumption.

What a sweet thing to say.

My boys were actually the motivation for me to be serious about getting help. Since they only had 1 parent, they deserved a functional one.

flan

huskerbb · Guru

flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
And some people are too selfish to be parents.

flan
No doubt--and that can certainly mean a crappy childhood--but it doesn't have to mean a crappy adulthood unless you let it.
I agree, but some people take longer to get over it than others.
flan

That's their problem.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
And some people are too selfish to be parents.

flan
No doubt--and that can certainly mean a crappy childhood--but it doesn't have to mean a crappy adulthood unless you let it.
I agree, but some people take longer to get over it than others.
flan
That's their problem.

It's their personality.

flan

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

flan327 wrote:

huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
And some people are too selfish to be parents.

flan
No doubt--and that can certainly mean a crappy childhood--but it doesn't have to mean a crappy adulthood unless you let it.
I agree, but some people take longer to get over it than others.
flan
That's their problem.
It's their personality.
flan

You aren't answering the question. Who is served by years and decades of reliving the past?

Empyreal · Senior Member

It's easy to tell other people to get over it when you yourself are in good health mentally. A lot of the people that have issues don't know why they behave the way they do and they need to get help to obtain coping skills and other life skills that they weren't taught as children.

And I'm talking about seriously defective stuff. Not spoiled brats who didn't have a perfect childhood. Nobody has a perfect childhood.

But there are people who have been severely damaged at the hands of their parents through neglect or physical/emotional abuse. It's not easy for these people to just move past it. It is at the very center of who they are as a person. They can't just get over it. It's the core of who they are.

For example, take a kid out of a concentration camp in South Korea and see how he/she acts as an adult if you don't intervene with mental health services. It's not going to be a smooth adult-hood for that person if you tell them "the past is the past, get over it already".

Some situations are severe and people need help that they often times don't get because they don't have the wherewithal to help themselves and nobody else intervenes on their behalf.

ed11563 · Guru

Empyreal wrote:
It's easy to tell other people to get over it when you yourself are in good health mentally. A lot of the people that have issues don't know why they behave the way they do and they need to get help to obtain coping skills and other life skills that they weren't taught as children.

And I'm talking about seriously defective stuff. Not spoiled brats who didn't have a perfect childhood. Nobody has a perfect childhood.

But there are people who have been severely damaged at the hands of their parents through neglect or physical/emotional abuse. It's not easy for these people to just move past it. It is at the very center of who they are as a person. They can't just get over it. It's the core of who they are.

For example, take a kid out of a concentration camp in South Korea and see how he/she acts as an adult if you don't intervene with mental health services. It's not going to be a smooth adult-hood for that person if you tell them "the past is the past, get over it already".

Some situations are severe and people need help that they often times don't get because they don't have the wherewithal to help themselves and nobody else intervenes on their behalf.

Thank you Empy, many people who had decent parents, just don't have a clue.

ed11563 · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
flan327 wrote:

huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
And some people are too selfish to be parents.

flan
No doubt--and that can certainly mean a crappy childhood--but it doesn't have to mean a crappy adulthood unless you let it.
I agree, but some people take longer to get over it than others.
flan
That's their problem.
It's their personality.
flan

You aren't answering the question. Who is served by years and decades of reliving the past?

It's not a question of "reliving the past', it's more "being stuck". After more than 35 years of therapy, Spouse is still stuck, still hears her mother's words and attitudes inside her head. "If it feels good, YOU'RE BAD!!!"

For clarity, growing up she was hit EVERY day for made-up reasons, occasionally beaten severely by her mother and sodomized by her mother, and incested by an older brother. Whenever anything went wrong in her household, she was blamed and beaten. Her brother wrote on the window screen with crayons, and admitted it ...

and she was beaten for it.

How does one "get over" being taught that her role in life is to be a punching bag? Sometimes surviving is an accomplishment.

Tangerine · Guru

ed11563 wrote:
Empyreal wrote:
It's easy to tell other people to get over it when you yourself are in good health mentally. A lot of the people that have issues don't know why they behave the way they do and they need to get help to obtain coping skills and other life skills that they weren't taught as children.

And I'm talking about seriously defective stuff. Not spoiled brats who didn't have a perfect childhood. Nobody has a perfect childhood.

But there are people who have been severely damaged at the hands of their parents through neglect or physical/emotional abuse. It's not easy for these people to just move past it. It is at the very center of who they are as a person. They can't just get over it. It's the core of who they are.

For example, take a kid out of a concentration camp in South Korea and see how he/she acts as an adult if you don't intervene with mental health services. It's not going to be a smooth adult-hood for that person if you tell them "the past is the past, get over it already".

Some situations are severe and people need help that they often times don't get because they don't have the wherewithal to help themselves and nobody else intervenes on their behalf.
Thank you Empy, many people who had decent parents, just don't have a clue.

Yes, thank you empy. Some people are actually damaged by their childhood. It takes a little more than "get over it" to be a functional person after that.

People who haven't been there can't understand what it's like.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Amen, Tang.

flan

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

I don't think it's about "getting over" anything.

It more about not letting it control you.

Yeah, some had horrific childhoods. Some didnt.

Point is, you have to learn how to deal.

Blankie · Guru

I've found reliving and rehashing the past is not useful in and of itself.

But that's not what this article is about, if you actually read it.

It's about learning ways to re-parent yourself, which is hugely helpful.

And very different from beating the dead horse of the past.

I had a very skilled therapist who knew how to take a past episode, and help me flip it around to find the incorrect belief I gleaned from it, and then re-work it to a healthy habit or belief.

Rehashing doesn't accomplish that. Re-WORKING it does.

It's important to correct those erroneous beliefs and replace them with healthy ones.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

ed11563 wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
flan327 wrote:

huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
And some people are too selfish to be parents.

flan
No doubt--and that can certainly mean a crappy childhood--but it doesn't have to mean a crappy adulthood unless you let it.
I agree, but some people take longer to get over it than others.
flan
That's their problem.
It's their personality.
flan

You aren't answering the question. Who is served by years and decades of reliving the past?
It's not a question of "reliving the past', it's more "being stuck". After more than 35 years of therapy, Spouse is still stuck, still hears her mother's words and attitudes inside her head. "If it feels good, YOU'RE BAD!!!"
For clarity, growing up she was hit EVERY day for made-up reasons, occasionally beaten severely by her mother and sodomized by her mother, and incested by an older brother. Whenever anything went wrong in her household, she was blamed and beaten. Her brother wrote on the window screen with crayons, and admitted it ...
and she was beaten for it.
How does one "get over" being taught that her role in life is to be a punching bag? Sometimes surviving is an accomplishment.

That's something none of us can answer Ed. And, yes that is horrible for her. However, 35 YEARS of her life have come and gone. And, the rest of her life is yet to be lived and will she allow herself to live it fully or not?

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Blankie wrote:
I've found reliving and rehashing the past is not useful in and of itself.
But that's not what this article is about, if you actually read it.
It's about learning ways to re-parent yourself, which is hugely helpful.
And very different from beating the dead horse of the past.
I had a very skilled therapist who knew how to take a past episode, and help me flip it around to find the incorrect belief I gleaned from it, and then re-work it to a healthy habit or belief.
Rehashing doesn't accomplish that. Re-WORKING it does.
It's important to correct those erroneous beliefs and replace them with healthy ones.

Very well said!

flan

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Blankie wrote:
I've found reliving and rehashing the past is not useful in and of itself.
But that's not what this article is about, if you actually read it.
It's about learning ways to re-parent yourself, which is hugely helpful.
And very different from beating the dead horse of the past.
I had a very skilled therapist who knew how to take a past episode, and help me flip it around to find the incorrect belief I gleaned from it, and then re-work it to a healthy habit or belief.
Rehashing doesn't accomplish that. Re-WORKING it does.
It's important to correct those erroneous beliefs and replace them with healthy ones.

Well said Blankie. And, I think you have to learn to give yourself what others could not or would not.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Blankie wrote:
I've found reliving and rehashing the past is not useful in and of itself.
But that's not what this article is about, if you actually read it.
It's about learning ways to re-parent yourself, which is hugely helpful.
And very different from beating the dead horse of the past.
I had a very skilled therapist who knew how to take a past episode, and help me flip it around to find the incorrect belief I gleaned from it, and then re-work it to a healthy habit or belief.
Rehashing doesn't accomplish that. Re-WORKING it does.
It's important to correct those erroneous beliefs and replace them with healthy ones.

Well said Blankie. And, I think you have to learn to give yourself what others could not or would not.

This too!

flan

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Blankie wrote:
I've found reliving and rehashing the past is not useful in and of itself.
But that's not what this article is about, if you actually read it.
It's about learning ways to re-parent yourself, which is hugely helpful.
And very different from beating the dead horse of the past.
I had a very skilled therapist who knew how to take a past episode, and help me flip it around to find the incorrect belief I gleaned from it, and then re-work it to a healthy habit or belief.
Rehashing doesn't accomplish that. Re-WORKING it does.
It's important to correct those erroneous beliefs and replace them with healthy ones.

The article sounds like it is talking to an adolescent - telling them to learn to parent themselves, find teachers, counselors, etc. to help. The problem is - what kind of kid is going to see that article? Almost everyone seeing it is going to be a grown adult - one who should already have conquered their childhood.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

There are a lot of adults carrying the baggage of childhood so I do think the advice is valuable and relevant. Not everyone can throw that switch at 18 and say "oh i am adult and put that behind me". It is often a process of gaining the insight and ability to do that so while i agree that ultimately you need to pull up your own bootstraps, i think there are damaged people who need to be find the tools to do that over time.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

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Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

flan327 wrote:
Blankie wrote:
I've found reliving and rehashing the past is not useful in and of itself.
But that's not what this article is about, if you actually read it.
It's about learning ways to re-parent yourself, which is hugely helpful.
And very different from beating the dead horse of the past.
I had a very skilled therapist who knew how to take a past episode, and help me flip it around to find the incorrect belief I gleaned from it, and then re-work it to a healthy habit or belief.
Rehashing doesn't accomplish that. Re-WORKING it does.
It's important to correct those erroneous beliefs and replace them with healthy ones.

Very well said!
flan

If you have been in therapy for 35 years and made no progress your therapist is flawed. There are two things here. Everyone here has screamed JUST GET HELP AND GET OVER IT. But how many threads do we have where people totally put down therapy and call it junk and make fun of people who need/want to go for therapy. All the damn time. So that's an issue. People need to be encouraged, not discouraged, to seek help. But therapy should be helping you put your life back on track. You should make progress and move forward. If you're not doing that then therapy isn't working.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Abuse changes the neurological pathways in your brain. You literally cannot think like everyone else because your brain is physical different than everyone else's brain. Saying "don't let it ruin your life" is silly. Victims don't enjoy their situation. But they lack the skills to recognize what is happening because they have been taught it is normal. Their brains are vastly different than the average person's because of the very abuse you want them to just get over. It's not that easy.

Yes, some people are able to do it. Those people are the exception for a reason. It is not normal to be able to survive abuse and just deal with it on your own. If it was, everyone would in fact do it.

Empyreal · Senior Member

Mellow Momma wrote:
Abuse changes the neurological pathways in your brain. You literally cannot think like everyone else because your brain is physical different than everyone else's brain. Saying "don't let it ruin your life" is silly. Victims don't enjoy their situation. But they lack the skills to recognize what is happening because they have been taught it is normal. Their brains are vastly different than the average person's because of the very abuse you want them to just get over. It's not that easy.

Yes, some people are able to do it. Those people are the exception for a reason. It is not normal to be able to survive abuse and just deal with it on your own. If it was, everyone would in fact do it.

Spot on!

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Oh dear.

So 20 years later, it's still someone else's fault they can't get their stuff together?

I don't buy that.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

lilyofcourse wrote:
Oh dear.

So 20 years later, it's still someone else's fault they can't get their stuff together?

I don't buy that.

Well it really doesn't matter if you "buy it" or not. Their brains are physically different, MRI's show the difference - you can see it. Their brains and their thinking is profoundly changed whether you agree with it or not. I am not saying they are incapable of helping themselves. I am saying it is almost impossible for them to realize they need to help themselves because of the way their brains work - due to the abuse. But all the intro to psych textbooks could be totally wrong. Because Lily doesn't agree.

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

I agree with everything you said MM except that people are incapable of changing. I'm not saying that changing is easy or is a short term process. But it can, and should, happen. If you are in a relationship with someone you need to make them get help. And yes, you can give them the alternative that either you get help or I walk. No one should live with someone who is still so crippled by their past that they can't function. There's a name for those people too. Enablers.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
I agree with everything you said MM except that people are incapable of changing. I'm not saying that changing is easy or is a short term process. But it can, and should, happen. If you are in a relationship with someone you need to make them get help. And yes, you can give them the alternative that either you get help or I walk. No one should live with someone who is still so crippled by their past that they can't function. There's a name for those people too. Enablers.

I believe people are capable of changing. I don't believe it is realistic for us to expect person to be able to pick themselves up and change on their own.

And enablers are just as ill as those they enable. It's just a different kind of illness.