TOTALLY GEEKED!

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

RE: Our mentally disabled daughter is pregnant. Should we take her for an abortion?

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

I think if her parents petitioned for a court order for it, they would get one. Especially in light of her current pregnancy.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Mellow Momma wrote:
www.salon.com/2015/10/04/parental_rights_for_rapists_youd_be_surprised_how_cruel_the_law_can_be/

This article is a great read about a rapist's parental rights and how the rapist will offer hold the victim hostage over those rights. One rapist agreed to terminate his rights and sign adoption papers, but only if the victim refused to testify against him. Another, who was ordered to pay child support, then demanded visitation and got it! If the victim wanted the child support he demanded visitation rights, but offered to sign his rights away if she refused the child support. Victims often have to consult their attackers on which school the child should attend, and other parental decisions.

No thanks.

-- Edited by Mellow Momma on Saturday 9th of January 2016 09:32:10 AM

Well, life is messy. Life is not ideal. You have to play the cards you are dealt. Notwithstanding, i would not kill my grandchild because of difficult circumstances.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

This article is really good at looking at the history and both sides of the issue in order to advise pediatricians on how to handle this. I do like the historical points made. For a while, sterilization was taboo, but as our society has gotten more sexually free and the opportunities for the mentally disabled to have sex have increased - it is now an issue again and acceptable in some circumstances. I mean, there was a time when they were using sterilization to weed out the less desirable and of course, the mentally handicapped used to be locked away without as much opportunity for sex. The realities of life now have to be taken into consideration.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
More recently, ethical precepts and public policy have emphasized the importance of providing the least restrictive life alternatives for persons with cognitive and other disabilities or disorders. The result has been proscriptions on limits on reproduction, including sterilization. At the same time, expanded social opportunities have increased the likelihood that individuals with developmental disabilities will engage in sexual contact that can lead to pregnancy. A proportion of these pregnancies will endanger the health of the pregnant individual or be unwanted. Some will be the result of sexual exploitation or assault. A few parents and other guardians retain an interest in male sterilization either to simply preclude impregnation of others or with a belief that it may help prevent sexually aggressive behavior by males. Sterilization of females is similarly sought to prevent pregnancy, especially when those responsible for a person with severe mental disability believe that she cannot adequately care for a child.

Link for whole article: http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/104/2/337

______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

ed11563 · Guru

Mellow Momma wrote:
In a lot of states, rapists have complete parental rights. The right to demand visitation etc even if it's in jail.

One of my college room mates was from a little town in the Appalachian Mountains.

There was a saying there that applies to nasty predators like that ...

"Some folks just needs killin'."

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Some folks do need killin'. I agree with that. So, I would hope that a rapist is like PUT IN JAIL, ya know?

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

In doing some quick research on the topic, it seems that a lot of disabled women are on some form of hormonal birth control. IUD's are not used because a majority of the women cannot bear the exam to fit and place one. Those on hormonal birth control often have to undergo general anesthesia for their Pap smears because the exam is so terrifying to them. Doctors do perform sterilization procedures on patients who cannot consent to them. The average city hospital sees about 1-2 per year. It needs to be proven that the patient either understands and consents to the surgery or does not possess the ability to consent to it. If they do not have the ability to consent, the guardian and Doctor can proceed - without court intervention in some states. It varies by state.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Lawyerlady wrote:
This article is really good at looking at the history and both sides of the issue in order to advise pediatricians on how to handle this. I do like the historical points made. For a while, sterilization was taboo, but as our society has gotten more sexually free and the opportunities for the mentally disabled to have sex have increased - it is now an issue again and acceptable in some circumstances. I mean, there was a time when they were using sterilization to weed out the less desirable and of course, the mentally handicapped used to be locked away without as much opportunity for sex. The realities of life now have to be taken into consideration.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
More recently, ethical precepts and public policy have emphasized the importance of providing the least restrictive life alternatives for persons with cognitive and other disabilities or disorders. The result has been proscriptions on limits on reproduction, including sterilization. At the same time, expanded social opportunities have increased the likelihood that individuals with developmental disabilities will engage in sexual contact that can lead to pregnancy. A proportion of these pregnancies will endanger the health of the pregnant individual or be unwanted. Some will be the result of sexual exploitation or assault. A few parents and other guardians retain an interest in male sterilization either to simply preclude impregnation of others or with a belief that it may help prevent sexually aggressive behavior by males. Sterilization of females is similarly sought to prevent pregnancy, especially when those responsible for a person with severe mental disability believe that she cannot adequately care for a child.
Link for whole article: http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/104/2/337

______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Least invasive for of birth control. So if a disabled person cannot bear the pap smear and must be put under general anesthesia each time...a tubal would actually be less invasive as it would be one occurance of anesthesia and not several.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
www.salon.com/2015/10/04/parental_rights_for_rapists_youd_be_surprised_how_cruel_the_law_can_be/

This article is a great read about a rapist's parental rights and how the rapist will offer hold the victim hostage over those rights. One rapist agreed to terminate his rights and sign adoption papers, but only if the victim refused to testify against him. Another, who was ordered to pay child support, then demanded visitation and got it! If the victim wanted the child support he demanded visitation rights, but offered to sign his rights away if she refused the child support. Victims often have to consult their attackers on which school the child should attend, and other parental decisions.

No thanks.

-- Edited by Mellow Momma on Saturday 9th of January 2016 09:32:10 AM
Well, life is messy. Life is not ideal. You have to play the cards you are dealt. Notwithstanding, i would not kill my grandchild because of difficult circumstances.

I posted that info in order to advocate for permanent sterilization - not necessarily abortion. I think the abortion should have been prevented by thinking about this proactively like any other teenager and sexuality. She doesn't possess the ability to consent, and I wouldn't want to deal with my child's rapist for the rest of my life as we raised the grandchild. So I would prevent it.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

I agree.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

Hormonal BC can have some nasty side effects too.

There is a leven of trial and error in finding the right BC. And it changes over time.

So if a person can't properly communicate with the doctor, then it could, very well, be a crap shoot.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Lots of the articles mentioned how the women couldn't even take care of their own menstrual needs. They were terrified of the process, they were inappropriate with their pads (brinigng them out to show people, not changing them often enough etc) and they lacked the ability to understand the situation or what was happening to them. For some, each month it is a re-explaining of the whole situation. That is more trauma than is necessary. AND, putting them under anesthesia for a Pap smear is not practical nor safe.

chef · Guru

Mellow Momma wrote:
In a lot of states, rapists have complete parental rights. The right to demand visitation etc even if it's in jail.

This is disgusting.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

chef wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
In a lot of states, rapists have complete parental rights. The right to demand visitation etc even if it's in jail.
This is disgusting.

31 states give rapists full parental rights. The rapist typically uses that fact to blackmail the victim into refusing to testify. Don't testify and I will sign away my rights. Testify against me and I demand my rights.