TOTALLY GEEKED!

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Dear Harriette: Daughter Doesn't want Widowed Mom to Date

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

I think mom is making a big mistake. By stopping her relationship with her boyfriend, she is sending the message that her daughter gets to make the rules of her life. It's been 4 years. Mom can and should move on. Instead of pausing her relationship, she should have made it very clear to her daughter, that her daughter does not dictate mom's life. And, yes, of course, the daughter may feel threatened by the relationship. She may feel that she will lose her mom to, to the boyfriend, etc. And, yes, mom can reassure her that she loves her daughter and make sure to give their relationship the proper attention. But the 15 yr old does not get to dictate mom's relationships. And, now, she has just empowered her daughter and sent the message that if she acts out enough, mom will cave. So, best be prepared for a lot more acting out now when she does resume the relationship because it will get even uglier until mom decides to make it clear that daughter doesnt run the show.

FNW · Guru

Counseling? Ugh. Why oh why does every situation seem to warrant counseling? Buck up and be the parent, the adult, and tell baby girl to shut it and learn respect. She doesn't have to like the situation, but she does have to keep her trap shut.

Dona Worry Be Happy · Vette's SS!!

People howl when women choose a man over their kids, and now if you choose your kid over a man that is apparently wrong too.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Dona Worry Be Happy wrote:
People howl when women choose a man over their kids, and now if you choose your kid over a man that is apparently wrong too.

Huh? That isn't the situation here. She has been widowed for 4 years. And, the mom's who are choosing the men do so at the expense of their kid. Mom sounds very in tune with her daughter. She didn't move the BF in a month after dad died. This is a different situation.

FNW · Guru

If this were a toddler, I'd say chose the child. But this is a 15 year old. Almost old enough to drive. And to start dating herself. Unless boyfriend is abusive or a bad influence, I say let the woman date. She may need to spend more quality time with the daughter outside the presence of boyfriend, but she should not cut boyfriend out of her life entirely.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Yeah, if the BF was an abusive jerk, then yes mom would be an idiot to keep him around.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

I think counseling was suggested because it's been 4 years and the daughter has not completed the grieving process. It's time to get her some help to do so.

Momala · Great cook-happy wife-superb fisherman

MM, you're spot on! Four years is generally long enough to come to terms with the loss of a parent. Counseling should help the daughter realize that her Mom's life didn't end four years ago. That there is enough love in Mom's heart to include both DD and the boyfriend. I think Mom would be making a serious mistake in backing off with the BF - daughter will be away at college or off on her own in four years, and then where will Mom be?

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

That girl was 11 when her dad died. Psychologists say that when a traumatic even happens, your growth as a person is put on hold. So this 15 year old girl is acting like a 11-12 year old because her development was stunted due to the death of her parent. Honestly, most children who lose a parent should be out into counseling immediately so that they can continue to develop. It's a shame that this mother has waited 4 years to get her daughter some help - but it's time to do so now.

-- Edited by Mellow Momma on Saturday 23rd of January 2016 10:19:21 AM

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
I think mom is making a big mistake. By stopping her relationship with her boyfriend, she is sending the message that her daughter gets to make the rules of her life. It's been 4 years. Mom can and should move on. Instead of pausing her relationship, she should have made it very clear to her daughter, that her daughter does not dictate mom's life. And, yes, of course, the daughter may feel threatened by the relationship. She may feel that she will lose her mom to, to the boyfriend, etc. And, yes, mom can reassure her that she loves her daughter and make sure to give their relationship the proper attention. But the 15 yr old does not get to dictate mom's relationships. And, now, she has just empowered her daughter and sent the message that if she acts out enough, mom will cave. So, best be prepared for a lot more acting out now when she does resume the relationship because it will get even uglier until mom decides to make it clear that daughter doesnt run the show.

I agree. Huge mistake. The counseling isn't a bad idea--the girl certainly needs it--but giving in to tantrums, not matter the root cause, is never good.

huskerbb · Guru

Mellow Momma wrote:
That girl was 11 when her dad died. Psychologists say that when a traumatic even happens, your growth as a person is put on hold. So this 15 year old girl is acting like a 11-12 year old because her development was stunted due to the death of her parent. Honestly, most children who lose a parent should be out into counseling immediately so that they can continue to develop. It's a shame that this mother has waited 4 years to get her daughter some help - but it's time to do so now.

-- Edited by Mellow Momma on Saturday 23rd of January 2016 10:19:21 AM

But MOST kids who go through traumatic events--even the loss of a parent--don't get counseling and turn out "fine".

Maybe this girl didn't really display such behaviors until this recent development.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

There is NOTHING wrong with counseling. Sheesh. But, yeah, you don't always need professional counseling. Sometimes you just need a good talk with a friend. It isn't necessarily about grieving her dad either. She may just be jealous of mom's time. I don't think that is unusual when a step parent comes in to the picture.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
That girl was 11 when her dad died. Psychologists say that when a traumatic even happens, your growth as a person is put on hold. So this 15 year old girl is acting like a 11-12 year old because her development was stunted due to the death of her parent. Honestly, most children who lose a parent should be out into counseling immediately so that they can continue to develop. It's a shame that this mother has waited 4 years to get her daughter some help - but it's time to do so now.

-- Edited by Mellow Momma on Saturday 23rd of January 2016 10:19:21 AM
But MOST kids who go through traumatic events--even the loss of a parent--don't get counseling and turn out "fine".
Maybe this girl didn't really display such behaviors until this recent development.

I disagree 100%. I think that most kids who go through traumatic events come out messed up. Unless they get some help. Just because they manage to function and go to work/school and LOOK fine doesn't mean they really are fine. It comes out in their relationships with others. So they may appear to have it all taken care of, but they are messed up.

huskerbb · Guru

Mellow Momma wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
That girl was 11 when her dad died. Psychologists say that when a traumatic even happens, your growth as a person is put on hold. So this 15 year old girl is acting like a 11-12 year old because her development was stunted due to the death of her parent. Honestly, most children who lose a parent should be out into counseling immediately so that they can continue to develop. It's a shame that this mother has waited 4 years to get her daughter some help - but it's time to do so now.

-- Edited by Mellow Momma on Saturday 23rd of January 2016 10:19:21 AM
But MOST kids who go through traumatic events--even the loss of a parent--don't get counseling and turn out "fine".
Maybe this girl didn't really display such behaviors until this recent development.
I disagree 100%. I think that most kids who go through traumatic events come out messed up. Unless they get some help. Just because they manage to function and go to work/school and LOOK fine doesn't mean they really are fine. It comes out in their relationships with others. So they may appear to have it all taken care of, but they are messed up.

They are as "fine" as those who don't get counseling. You seem to think that is important. For some, it probably is. For many--it is NOT.

FNW · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
There is NOTHING wrong with counseling. Sheesh. But, yeah, you don't always need professional counseling. Sometimes you just need a good talk with a friend. It isn't necessarily about grieving her dad either. She may just be jealous of mom's time. I don't think that is unusual when a step parent comes in to the picture.

I agree.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

I am just saying that I know an awful lot of people who went through some sort of trauma who say "I went through that and I turned out just fine". And those people are decidedly NOT fine. They think they are fine because they have jobs and function. But if you know them well, they are actually pretty f***ed up people who could use some counseling. But they think they are fine.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Counseling can be very useful - but it is the daughter that needs it, not the mom.

huskerbb · Guru

Mellow Momma wrote:
I am just saying that I know an awful lot of people who went through some sort of trauma who say "I went through that and I turned out just fine". And those people are decidedly NOT fine. They think they are fine because they have jobs and function. But if you know them well, they are actually pretty f***ed up people who could use some counseling. But they think they are fine.

Counseling isn't some cure all. Most of the time it doesn't do diddly.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?

As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.

huskerbb · Guru

Well, it helps line the pockets of those in the field.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

They probably could benefit from a neutral place to talk and air things out.

This girl is 15. At 15 it's hard to see past your own feelings.

Mom can continue the relationship with BF, she doesn't have to marry him tomorrow.

But it sounds like the daughter is still struggling with the loss of her dad.

The daughter may not fully understand that the new guy won't and isn't trying to replace dad.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.

So you got nothing.

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.

And neither does anyone who says it is the cure-all for everyone's problems.

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Counseling isn't a "cure all". It's a tool to help in the recovery process. Many things play into that process. Some people go with no intention of ever getting better. Some therapists have no problem keeping patients in therapy for years. But a lot of people can go to therapy, get help, and eventually begin to learn new ways to deal with things.

When I first got married we had so much going on. His ex, at one point, said she wanted me dead. There was always a battle. Then we had to deal with my ex. And at the same time my son was diagnosed with aspergers. We had so much on our plate. We went to counseling and he really helped us learn some new ways to look at things and handle situations. I don't think we would have made it without some of those sessions. Every once in awhile we go back in and talk to him. But we have come to the point where we no longer need to see him on a constant basis. So yes, counseling CAN help. It's not always a failure.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.
And neither does anyone who says it is the cure-all for everyone's problems.

Is a medical doctor a cure all for your health? No. You spend your life tweaking your physical health. So, if you have high blood pressure and your medical doctor didnt' fix it after 2 visits then that is a failure? Or diabetes or anything else? Why is your mental emotional health somehow different? There may be times in life you may need that.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in husker's philosophy.

My apologies to Shakespeare.

huskerbb · Guru

Nobody Just Nobody wrote:
Counseling isn't a "cure all". It's a tool to help in the recovery process. Many things play into that process. Some people go with no intention of ever getting better. Some therapists have no problem keeping patients in therapy for years. But a lot of people can go to therapy, get help, and eventually begin to learn new ways to deal with things.

When I first got married we had so much going on. His ex, at one point, said she wanted me dead. There was always a battle. Then we had to deal with my ex. And at the same time my son was diagnosed with aspergers. We had so much on our plate. We went to counseling and he really helped us learn some new ways to look at things and handle situations. I don't think we would have made it without some of those sessions. Every once in awhile we go back in and talk to him. But we have come to the point where we no longer need to see him on a constant basis. So yes, counseling CAN help. It's not always a failure.

It's a tool for SOME people. Not everyone needs it.

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.
And neither does anyone who says it is the cure-all for everyone's problems.
Is a medical doctor a cure all for your health? No. You spend your life tweaking your physical health. So, if you have high blood pressure and your medical doctor didnt' fix it after 2 visits then that is a failure? Or diabetes or anything else? Why is your mental emotional health somehow different? There may be times in life you may need that.

Mental health is absolutely different. It simply CANNOT be quantified.

When your blood pressure isn't adjusted--you know it. You can measure it. Not so with mental health.

SOME people may need it--not everyone does.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Untrue. Mental health can be quantified. One such measure is your ability to function such as holding down a job , personal hgiene, fulfilling your responsibilities in life such as caring for your children etc. Someone with serious mental health issues such as schizophrenia will start to show signs of the above. Inability to hold down a job. Maybe becomes disheveled. These are often the first signs in this and some other mental illnesses.

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Untrue. Mental health can be quantified. One such measure is your ability to function such as holding down a job , personal hgiene, fulfilling your responsibilities in life such as caring for your children etc. Someone with serious mental health issues such as schizophrenia will start to show signs of the above. Inability to hold down a job. Maybe becomes disheveled. These are often the first signs in this and some other mental illnesses.

That's not quantifying anything. People don't do those things all in exactly the same way, anyway. Lots of people who don't hold down a job are just lazy--it has nothing to do with any mental illness.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.

husker has no respect for psychologists or psychiatrists...

flan

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.
And neither does anyone who says it is the cure-all for everyone's problems.
Is a medical doctor a cure all for your health? No. You spend your life tweaking your physical health. So, if you have high blood pressure and your medical doctor didnt' fix it after 2 visits then that is a failure? Or diabetes or anything else? Why is your mental emotional health somehow different? There may be times in life you may need that.
Mental health is absolutely different. It simply CANNOT be quantified.
When your blood pressure isn't adjusted--you know it. You can measure it. Not so with mental health.
SOME people may need it--not everyone does.

Brain scans absolutely show differences between healthy & not.

flan

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

You know - the kid might just be a brat. Teenagers are well known for being self-centered.

huskerbb · Guru

flan327 wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.
husker has no respect for psychologists or psychiatrists...
flan

No. I don't. Usually when they "help"--it's because they have the "patient" popping some pills.

huskerbb · Guru

Lawyerlady wrote:
You know - the kid might just be a brat. Teenagers are well known for being self-centered.

Yeah. Not every little thing requires counseling.

Yes, losing a parent is a traumatic event--but apparently she was coping until mom decided to get a boyfriend. Now all of a sudden she can't? BS.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.
husker has no respect for psychologists or psychiatrists...
flan
No. I don't. Usually when they "help"--it's because they have the "patient" popping some pills.

There are a lot of people popping pills who are to lazy to exercise and go to the gym and lose weight so they wouldnt be on BP pills , cholesterol pills , type2 diabetes pills and on and on.

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.
husker has no respect for psychologists or psychiatrists...
flan
No. I don't. Usually when they "help"--it's because they have the "patient" popping some pills.
There are a lot of people popping pills who are to lazy to exercise and go to the gym and lose weight so they wouldnt be on BP pills , cholesterol pills , type2 diabetes pills and on and on.

And so are they truly being helped? That's my point.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.
husker has no respect for psychologists or psychiatrists...
flan
No. I don't. Usually when they "help"--it's because they have the "patient" popping some pills.
There are a lot of people popping pills who are to lazy to exercise and go to the gym and lose weight so they wouldnt be on BP pills , cholesterol pills , type2 diabetes pills and on and on.
And so are they truly being helped? That's my point.

Yes, they are to some extent. It really needs to a multi pronged approach. Medication, while useful, alone isn't going to give you optimal health. So, you need the counseling/lifestyle changes as well. With mental health, i have never advocated 'pill popping' which seems to be what you are implying. I personally think one would be better off to go for counseling first, prior to starting medication to start to sort out whatever the issues are. Then if medication is also deemed necessary, then taking that in conjuction with counseling or having at least explored counseling as well. However, there are also people for who medication may help who have more minor issues but maybe they don't need counseling. Just like some in better health who already diet and exercise might tweak their health with medication.

Anyway, nobody is forcing you to go to counseling, so not sure why you have such an ax to grind about it. It doesn't affect you so why do you care?

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Actually, the standard is the opposite LGS. They prescribe meds to level out the patient so that they will be able to focus on the work done in therapy. Then, as they progress, the patient is weaned off the meds. When the situation is dire, you need to ensure the patient will be able to make it through their day and make it to the next therapy appointment - that's why they medicate first. Then when the patient isn't in the midst of an episode thanks to the meds, they can really concentrate on the work they need to do in therapy.

Those who have such a low opinion of therapists seem not to have a good grasp on what they actually DO, nor how they actually do it.

huskerbb · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
flan327 wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
huskerbb wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
And you know that how? Do u have some research to support that?
As much research as there is to show it helps in any way.
So you got nothing.
husker has no respect for psychologists or psychiatrists...
flan
No. I don't. Usually when they "help"--it's because they have the "patient" popping some pills.
There are a lot of people popping pills who are to lazy to exercise and go to the gym and lose weight so they wouldnt be on BP pills , cholesterol pills , type2 diabetes pills and on and on.
And so are they truly being helped? That's my point.
Yes, they are to some extent. It really needs to a multi pronged approach. Medication, while useful, alone isn't going to give you optimal health. So, you need the counseling/lifestyle changes as well. With mental health, i have never advocated 'pill popping' which seems to be what you are implying. I personally think one would be better off to go for counseling first, prior to starting medication to start to sort out whatever the issues are. Then if medication is also deemed necessary, then taking that in conjuction with counseling or having at least explored counseling as well. However, there are also people for who medication may help who have more minor issues but maybe they don't need counseling. Just like some in better health who already diet and exercise might tweak their health with medication.
Anyway, nobody is forcing you to go to counseling, so not sure why you have such an ax to grind about it. It doesn't affect you so why do you care?

Because it's a useless crutch that is damaging many in society.

hell, we cant even discipline kids, anymore. They all need counseling when they misbehave.

huskerbb · Guru

Mellow Momma wrote:
Actually, the standard is the opposite LGS. They prescribe meds to level out the patient so that they will be able to focus on the work done in therapy. Then, as they progress, the patient is weaned off the meds. When the situation is dire, you need to ensure the patient will be able to make it through their day and make it to the next therapy appointment - that's why they medicate first. Then when the patient isn't in the midst of an episode thanks to the meds, they can really concentrate on the work they need to do in therapy.

Those who have such a low opinion of therapists seem not to have a good grasp on what they actually DO, nor how they actually do it.

Well, most "do" virtually nothing.

huskerbb · Guru

I had a buddy on the verge of blowing up his life and marriage. I even recommended he see someone and get on some meds.

The "counselor" he saw told him that he was right, there was nothing wrong with him, blah, blah, blah.

His destructive behaviors continued. He lost his job. He lost his marriage. He damaged relationships with family and friends.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

There are good counselors and bad counselors. But a bad counselor during formative years can have lasting repercussions. After my sister died, my DH and my mother had a horrendous time adjusting and the first 2 counselors that DN went to made it WORSE. They decided to validate a teenager's feelings of misguided blame about her mother's death.

chef · Guru

Lawyerlady wrote:
There are good counselors and bad counselors. But a bad counselor during formative years can have lasting repercussions. After my sister died, my DH and my mother had a horrendous time adjusting and the first 2 counselors that DN went to made it WORSE. They decided to validate a teenager's feelings of misguided blame about her mother's death.

That's horrible :(

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

I had a terrible counselor.

He was so easily manipulated.

If it wasn't a suggestion by my lawyer, I wouldn't have gone back.

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

chef wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
There are good counselors and bad counselors. But a bad counselor during formative years can have lasting repercussions. After my sister died, my DH and my mother had a horrendous time adjusting and the first 2 counselors that DN went to made it WORSE. They decided to validate a teenager's feelings of misguided blame about her mother's death.
That's horrible :(

When we put DS in counseling right after he was diagnosed the counselor was horrible. He couldn't keep things straight, he called DS the wrong name multiple times, and generally just upset him. Counseling isn't supposed to make you MORE upset. We finally got to the point that we called the head of the office and complained. She started seeing my son from then on out and there was no issue. I don't know when the therapist left but shortly after that he was gone.

My sister went to a counselor to deal with some issues. She ended up sleeping with him. Part of that was my sister and her problems. But the bulk of it was the therapist. That should never happen.

There ARE bad therapists out there. Just like there are bad people out there in every profession.

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

Mellow Momma wrote:
Actually, the standard is the opposite LGS. They prescribe meds to level out the patient so that they will be able to focus on the work done in therapy. Then, as they progress, the patient is weaned off the meds. When the situation is dire, you need to ensure the patient will be able to make it through their day and make it to the next therapy appointment - that's why they medicate first. Then when the patient isn't in the midst of an episode thanks to the meds, they can really concentrate on the work they need to do in therapy.

Those who have such a low opinion of therapists seem not to have a good grasp on what they actually DO, nor how they actually do it.

I said this same thing on another thread!

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

chef wrote:
Lawyerlady wrote:
There are good counselors and bad counselors. But a bad counselor during formative years can have lasting repercussions. After my sister died, my DH and my mother had a horrendous time adjusting and the first 2 counselors that DN went to made it WORSE. They decided to validate a teenager's feelings of misguided blame about her mother's death.
That's horrible :(

Luckily, they finally found a good one. Unfortunately, he retired shortly thereafter. He continued to see DN for a while - he only kept 2 patients while in retirement and she was one of them.

The problem with therapists is that there are a lot of them that are not worth a damn.