TOTALLY GEEKED!

ed11563 · Guru

Supreme Court strikes down Texas abortion clinic regulations

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Thank you for posting, ed.

flan

ed11563 · Guru

(flame suit on ... )

Fort Worth Mom · Mod/Penguin lover/Princess!

No flame suit, needed, ed.

Now, talk to Joan Rivers daughter, about how safe clinics are.

She is suing the clinic, that killed her mother, for millions.

Any clinic, doing any kind of surgery...should have a hospital, waiting in the wings, just in case something goes wrong.

JMHO.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Yes, tell the over 400 women who have died from legal abortions that medical precautions are not necessary.

Idiots.

Vette · Owl drink to that!

Feminists aren't the majority in my house that's for dang sure.

ed11563 · Guru

Fort Worth Mom wrote:
No flame suit, needed, ed.
Now, talk to Joan Rivers daughter, about how safe clinics are.
She is suing the clinic, that killed her mother, for millions.
Any clinic, doing any kind of surgery...should have a hospital, waiting in the wings, just in case something goes wrong.
JMHO.

That was weird, because in Manhattan, where ever you are, there is a real hospital close by. Or several, if you're in wealthy area.

Clearly Joan did not choose her clinic carefully enough.

Or her doctor.

Fort Worth Mom · Mod/Penguin lover/Princess!

ed11563 wrote:
Fort Worth Mom wrote:
No flame suit, needed, ed.
Now, talk to Joan Rivers daughter, about how safe clinics are.
She is suing the clinic, that killed her mother, for millions.
Any clinic, doing any kind of surgery...should have a hospital, waiting in the wings, just in case something goes wrong.
JMHO.
That was weird, because in Manhattan, where ever you are, there is a real hospital close by. Or several, if you're in wealthy area.

Clearly Joan did not choose her clinic carefully enough.
Or her doctor.

So, what chance would someone wanting to end her pregnancy have?

She is probably not "of great means".

So, she should die, because she went to a clinic, that wasn't part of a hospital system?

That doesn't make sense, to me.

WYSIWYG · Guru

Comparing what happened to Joan Rivers and what happens to a young woman of childbearing age isn't exactly comparing apples to apples, is it? Both for reasons of age and reasons of difference of procedure.

Lindley · Guru

Fort Worth Mom wrote:
No flame suit, needed, ed.
Now, talk to Joan Rivers daughter, about how safe clinics are.
She is suing the clinic, that killed her mother, for millions.
Any clinic, doing any kind of surgery...should have a hospital, waiting in the wings, just in case something goes wrong.
JMHO.

I agree with you fwm, like all medical procedures there are risk involved.

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

I really don't care whether it's an abortion, liposuction, a face lift, or you're having a wart removed. Your doctor should have privileges somewhere. Things can, and do, go wrong.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

From the OP:

The clinics that challenged the law argued that it was merely a veiled attempt to make it harder for women to get abortions by forcing the closure of more than half the roughly 40 clinics that operated before the law took effect.

Justice Stephen Breyer's majority opinion for the court held that the regulations are medically unnecessary and unconstitutionally limit women's right to abortions.

flan

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

flan327 wrote:
From the OP:

The clinics that challenged the law argued that it was merely a veiled attempt to make it harder for women to get abortions by forcing the closure of more than half the roughly 40 clinics that operated before the law took effect.

Justice Stephen Breyer's majority opinion for the court held that the regulations are medically unnecessary and unconstitutionally limit women's right to abortions.

flan

So? I'm sure proponents of abortion would like you to be able to get them at your local Starbucks.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

SCOTUS mentioned in their ruling that you are 10 times more likely to die from a colonoscopy but that Texas does not require admitting privileges for doctors doing those procedures and you can have one in a doc's office. This is the point - the laws targeted one medical procedure for no justifiable medical reason.

Oh - you are also 14 times more likely to die from child birth than an abortion but Texas law allows a woman to give birth in her own home.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Mellow Momma wrote:
SCOTUS mentioned in their ruling that you are 10 times more likely to die from a colonoscopy but that Texas does not require admitting privileges for doctors doing those procedures and you can have one in a doc's office. This is the point - the laws targeted one medical procedure for no justifiable medical reason.

Oh - you are also 14 times more likely to die from child birth than an abortion but Texas law allows a woman to give birth in her own home.

Do you have a link for that, regarding colonoscopies?

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Mellow Momma wrote:
SCOTUS mentioned in their ruling that you are 10 times more likely to die from a colonoscopy but that Texas does not require admitting privileges for doctors doing those procedures and you can have one in a doc's office. This is the point - the laws targeted one medical procedure for no justifiable medical reason.

Oh - you are also 14 times more likely to die from child birth than an abortion but Texas law allows a woman to give birth in her own home.

ALL procedures should require admitting privileges. ALL of them. That's about a DOCTOR doing a procedure - and has nothing to do with a woman choosing childbirth at home. If she wanted to give herself a home abortion - can't really stop that, either. This is about regulating DOCTORS that perform procedures, which Texas has the right to do.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lawyerlady wrote:
flan327 wrote:
From the OP:

The clinics that challenged the law argued that it was merely a veiled attempt to make it harder for women to get abortions by forcing the closure of more than half the roughly 40 clinics that operated before the law took effect.

Justice Stephen Breyer's majority opinion for the court held that the regulations are medically unnecessary and unconstitutionally limit women's right to abortions.

flan
So? I'm sure proponents of abortion would like you to be able to get them at your local Starbucks.

I can't even... confuse

flan

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

WYSIWYG wrote:
Comparing what happened to Joan Rivers and what happens to a young woman of childbearing age isn't exactly comparing apples to apples, is it? Both for reasons of age and reasons of difference of procedure.

Yes, that is absurd.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

BTW, Joan was SURROUNDED by highly qualified doctors of the highest caliber. And, yes, bad things can happen and there are risks to every procedure. But, her situation has NOTHING to do with this whatsoever.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Fort Worth Mom wrote:
No flame suit, needed, ed.
Now, talk to Joan Rivers daughter, about how safe clinics are.
She is suing the clinic, that killed her mother, for millions.
Any clinic, doing any kind of surgery...should have a hospital, waiting in the wings, just in case something goes wrong.
JMHO.

So, you want to eliminate all clinics now? Clinics and ambulatory surgery centers are very safe. And, if you have complications, you will transfer the pt so it isnt' like they are refusing to take a patient so not really sure what is you are proposing other than eliminating them all together. Guess what? People die at hospitals too.

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

OK, let's eliminate all clinics then. Good luck with getting abortions put into hospitals!!

Lindley · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
SCOTUS mentioned in their ruling that you are 10 times more likely to die from a colonoscopy but that Texas does not require admitting privileges for doctors doing those procedures and you can have one in a doc's office. This is the point - the laws targeted one medical procedure for no justifiable medical reason.

Oh - you are also 14 times more likely to die from child birth than an abortion but Texas law allows a woman to give birth in her own home.
Do you have a link for that, regarding colonoscopies?

I knew one my vendors niece died having a abortion. I'm not in favor of births at home either. All medical procedures has risk and just because abortion is a heavily political issue doesn't mean it is as safe as getting a wart removed.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lindley wrote:
Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
SCOTUS mentioned in their ruling that you are 10 times more likely to die from a colonoscopy but that Texas does not require admitting privileges for doctors doing those procedures and you can have one in a doc's office. This is the point - the laws targeted one medical procedure for no justifiable medical reason.

Oh - you are also 14 times more likely to die from child birth than an abortion but Texas law allows a woman to give birth in her own home.
Do you have a link for that, regarding colonoscopies?
I knew one my vendors niece died having a abortion. I'm not in favor of births at home either. All medical procedures has risk and just because abortion is a heavily political issue doesn't mean it is as safe as getting a wart removed.

I know that for years, women had no other option, but today we do.

So you make a valid point.

flan

Nobody Just Nobody · Rib-it! Rrrib-it!

I know a home birth that went terribly horribly wrong.

WYSIWYG · Guru

ALL procedures should require admitting privileges. ALL of them. That's about a DOCTOR doing a procedure - and has nothing to do with a woman choosing childbirth at home. If she wanted to give herself a home abortion - can't really stop that, either. This is about regulating DOCTORS that perform procedures, which Texas has the right to do.
- Lawyerlady

______________________________

Then the law should have said "providers of all medical procedures, no matter how safe or routine" not "abortion providers".

I think it would be overkill because I don't agree that all procedures should require admitting privileges, but that's one of the issues I had with the law. It was written specifically and exclusively to deny the right to abortion by eliminating available clinics, regardless of what any of the crafters of the law may say. Women could still legally GET them (so the weren't violating Roe v. Wade), but they just wouldn't be able to find a clinic that met the superfluous law. Making it not Texas' fault if women couldn't get one.

ed11563 · Guru

Fort Worth Mom wrote:
ed11563 wrote:
Fort Worth Mom wrote:
No flame suit, needed, ed.
Now, talk to Joan Rivers daughter, about how safe clinics are.
She is suing the clinic, that killed her mother, for millions.
Any clinic, doing any kind of surgery...should have a hospital, waiting in the wings, just in case something goes wrong.
JMHO.
That was weird, because in Manhattan, where ever you are, there is a real hospital close by. Or several, if you're in wealthy area.

Clearly Joan did not choose her clinic carefully enough.
Or her doctor.

So, what chance would someone wanting to end her pregnancy have?
She is probably not "of great means".
So, she should die, because she went to a clinic, that wasn't part of a hospital system?
That doesn't make sense, to me.

Every hospital with an Emergency Department will be happy to treat any woman who shows up in an ambulance in distress.

Her abortionist doesn't need to treat her, there are others who will work diligently to save her life and her uterus.

Catholic hospitals will also try to save her, if there is no baby to save first.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
SCOTUS mentioned in their ruling that you are 10 times more likely to die from a colonoscopy but that Texas does not require admitting privileges for doctors doing those procedures and you can have one in a doc's office. This is the point - the laws targeted one medical procedure for no justifiable medical reason.

Oh - you are also 14 times more likely to die from child birth than an abortion but Texas law allows a woman to give birth in her own home.
Do you have a link for that, regarding colonoscopies?

It is in the SCOTUS majority opinion.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-supreme-court-abortion-texas-20160627-snap-story.html

Justice Breyer is the one who commented that a colonoscopy is 10 times more dangerous than an abortion. And also a doctor or midwife may attend a home birth - when birth is 14 times more dangerous than an abortion and a home provides literally NO medical safeguards.

apple · Guru

Lawyerlady wrote:
flan327 wrote:
From the OP:

The clinics that challenged the law argued that it was merely a veiled attempt to make it harder for women to get abortions by forcing the closure of more than half the roughly 40 clinics that operated before the law took effect.

Justice Stephen Breyer's majority opinion for the court held that the regulations are medically unnecessary and unconstitutionally limit women's right to abortions.

flan
So? I'm sure proponents of abortion would like you to be able to get them at your local Starbucks.

ahh yes, but they would have a much better name for them.

Fort Worth Mom · Mod/Penguin lover/Princess!

ed11563 wrote:
Fort Worth Mom wrote:
ed11563 wrote:
Fort Worth Mom wrote:
No flame suit, needed, ed.
Now, talk to Joan Rivers daughter, about how safe clinics are.
She is suing the clinic, that killed her mother, for millions.
Any clinic, doing any kind of surgery...should have a hospital, waiting in the wings, just in case something goes wrong.
JMHO.
That was weird, because in Manhattan, where ever you are, there is a real hospital close by. Or several, if you're in wealthy area.

Clearly Joan did not choose her clinic carefully enough.
Or her doctor.

So, what chance would someone wanting to end her pregnancy have?
She is probably not "of great means".
So, she should die, because she went to a clinic, that wasn't part of a hospital system?
That doesn't make sense, to me.
Every hospital with an Emergency Department will be happy to treat any woman who shows up in an ambulance in distress.
Her abortionist doesn't need to treat her, there are others who will work diligently to save her life and her uterus.

Catholic hospitals will also try to save her, if there is no baby to save first.

ed, the Catholic Church, DOES NOT value one life over another.

And, I'm sick and tired, of you, spreading these lies.

Even, Dear Abby, got a clue...after she had been set straight.

Here's the article:

by Abigail Van Buren

Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Contact Dear Abby Print Article

DEAR ABBY: You printed a letter from a woman (Nov. 25) whose husband told her while she was pregnant that, if it came to a choice, he would choose the life of the baby over hers. Your response contained a piece of misinformation I would appreciate you correcting for your readers.

You asserted that it is Catholic policy to save the life of the baby over the mother in obstetrical emergencies. Abby, that is one of the oldest but most persistent pieces of misinformation out there! This inaccurate statement has been replayed even in movies in spite of repeated denials by Catholic hospitals and the professionals who render care in them.

The fact is: Catholic policy is abundantly clear on the dignity of both mother and baby, and makes no priority of one over the other. Catholic hospitals operate with the same standards of safety in maternity care and are inspected by the same organizations that inspect non-Catholic maternity programs such as the Joint Commission and the licensing agency of each state. Catholic hospitals must adhere to the same robust standards as every other maternity service in the country.

I would appreciate it if you could assure your readers that, while this makes for good movies and novels, it is not the Catholic position. The dignity of the life of both mother and baby are critically important to all those serving in Catholic health care. Thank you for your help with this. -- SR. CAROL KEEHAN, PRESIDENT AND CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, CATHOLIC HEALTH ASSOCIATION

DEAR SISTER CAROL: Since printing that letter, I have received a crash course in ethics at Catholic hospitals. I apologize to you and to my Catholic readers for saying what I did. In the interest of educating my readers, I am sharing some of the enlightening letters I received. Read on:

DEAR ABBY: In the days before blood banks and antibiotics, very few women survived C-sections. Obstetrical complications (now solved by surgical delivery) created a dilemma: Either allow a dysfunctional labor to continue until the child died and could be forcibly dragged or dissected through the birth canal, or perform the surgery that would cause the mother's death.

About the only time such an issue could arise in contemporary America would be in the rare case of a pregnant woman who is discovered to have an aggressive cancer, and has to decide whether to start chemo or radiation therapy that could abort or harm the fetus, or delay until after delivery, which could allow the tumor to grow or metastasize. -- ROBIN T., RICHMOND, CALIF.

DEAR ABBY: Devout Catholics are pro-life in every instance, and, of course, efforts to save both mother and infant are always the rule. But the value of the life of a newborn never surpasses the value of the life of the mother. Never! -- CATHOLIC DOCTOR IN OHIO

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

You know, any real mother would give her life for her child.

apple · Guru

lilyofcourse wrote:
You know, any real mother would give her life for her child.

You might, I might but some just don't have that feeling.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Must.Not.Respond.

flan

apple · Guru

flan327 wrote:
Must.Not.Respond.

flan

Focus flan... you can do it!!! biggrin

ed11563 · Guru

Fort Worth Mom wrote:
ed11563 wrote:
Fort Worth Mom wrote:
ed11563 wrote:
Fort Worth Mom wrote:
No flame suit, needed, ed.
Now, talk to Joan Rivers daughter, about how safe clinics are.
She is suing the clinic, that killed her mother, for millions.
Any clinic, doing any kind of surgery...should have a hospital, waiting in the wings, just in case something goes wrong.
JMHO.
That was weird, because in Manhattan, where ever you are, there is a real hospital close by. Or several, if you're in wealthy area.

Clearly Joan did not choose her clinic carefully enough.
Or her doctor.

So, what chance would someone wanting to end her pregnancy have?
She is probably not "of great means".
So, she should die, because she went to a clinic, that wasn't part of a hospital system?
That doesn't make sense, to me.
Every hospital with an Emergency Department will be happy to treat any woman who shows up in an ambulance in distress.
Her abortionist doesn't need to treat her, there are others who will work diligently to save her life and her uterus.

Catholic hospitals will also try to save her, if there is no baby to save first.
ed, the Catholic Church, DOES NOT value one life over another.
And, I'm sick and tired, of you, spreading these lies.
Even, Dear Abby, got a clue...after she had been set straight.
Here's the article:

by Abigail Van Buren
Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Contact Dear Abby Print Article
DEAR ABBY: You printed a letter from a woman (Nov. 25) whose husband told her while she was pregnant that, if it came to a choice, he would choose the life of the baby over hers. Your response contained a piece of misinformation I would appreciate you correcting for your readers.
You asserted that it is Catholic policy to save the life of the baby over the mother in obstetrical emergencies. Abby, that is one of the oldest but most persistent pieces of misinformation out there! This inaccurate statement has been replayed even in movies in spite of repeated denials by Catholic hospitals and the professionals who render care in them.
The fact is: Catholic policy is abundantly clear on the dignity of both mother and baby, and makes no priority of one over the other. Catholic hospitals operate with the same standards of safety in maternity care and are inspected by the same organizations that inspect non-Catholic maternity programs such as the Joint Commission and the licensing agency of each state. Catholic hospitals must adhere to the same robust standards as every other maternity service in the country.
I would appreciate it if you could assure your readers that, while this makes for good movies and novels, it is not the Catholic position. The dignity of the life of both mother and baby are critically important to all those serving in Catholic health care. Thank you for your help with this. -- SR. CAROL KEEHAN, PRESIDENT AND CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, CATHOLIC HEALTH ASSOCIATION
DEAR SISTER CAROL: Since printing that letter, I have received a crash course in ethics at Catholic hospitals. I apologize to you and to my Catholic readers for saying what I did. In the interest of educating my readers, I am sharing some of the enlightening letters I received. Read on:
DEAR ABBY: In the days before blood banks and antibiotics, very few women survived C-sections. Obstetrical complications (now solved by surgical delivery) created a dilemma: Either allow a dysfunctional labor to continue until the child died and could be forcibly dragged or dissected through the birth canal, or perform the surgery that would cause the mother's death.
About the only time such an issue could arise in contemporary America would be in the rare case of a pregnant woman who is discovered to have an aggressive cancer, and has to decide whether to start chemo or radiation therapy that could abort or harm the fetus, or delay until after delivery, which could allow the tumor to grow or metastasize. -- ROBIN T., RICHMOND, CALIF.
DEAR ABBY: Devout Catholics are pro-life in every instance, and, of course, efforts to save both mother and infant are always the rule. But the value of the life of a newborn never surpasses the value of the life of the mother. Never! -- CATHOLIC DOCTOR IN OHIO

Thanks for clarifying.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

apple wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
You know, any real mother would give her life for her child.

You might, I might but some just don't have that feeling.

Then that isn't a mother.

It isn't a woman.

They selfish, self centered, wastes of oxygen.

When someone seeks out to kill their child, they are a monster.

Fort Worth Mom · Mod/Penguin lover/Princess!

apple wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
You know, any real mother would give her life for her child.

You might, I might but some just don't have that feeling.

And you non Catholics, just don't get it.

Every life, is precious.

The Mom. The unborn baby.

The goal is, to save both of them.

No way, does a Catholic doctor, or hospital........put the baby's life, as more important, than the mothers.

They have to work, to save both of them.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

apple wrote:
flan327 wrote:
Must.Not.Respond.

flan
Focus flan... you can do it!!!

Will you hold me????

flan

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

FWM, I understand that.

I am saying that a mother will choose their child over them self.

Not talking about doctors.

A real mom will not seek out to kill her child.

Lawyerlady · On the bright side...... Christmas is coming! (Mod)

Fort Worth Mom wrote:
apple wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
You know, any real mother would give her life for her child.

You might, I might but some just don't have that feeling.
And you non Catholics, just don't get it.
Every life, is precious.
The Mom. The unborn baby.
The goal is, to save both of them.
No way, does a Catholic doctor, or hospital........put the baby's life, as more important, than the mothers.
They have to work, to save both of them.

I'm non Catholic and I get it.

Fort Worth Mom · Mod/Penguin lover/Princess!

Lawyerlady wrote:
Fort Worth Mom wrote:
apple wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
You know, any real mother would give her life for her child.

You might, I might but some just don't have that feeling.
And you non Catholics, just don't get it.
Every life, is precious.
The Mom. The unborn baby.
The goal is, to save both of them.
No way, does a Catholic doctor, or hospital........put the baby's life, as more important, than the mothers.
They have to work, to save both of them.
I'm non Catholic and I get it.

I'm glad, you do, LL.

ed, doesn't get it.

And, he needs to stop spreading, these lies.

ed11563 · Guru

Flame suit on

Lady Gaga Snerd · Guru

Some of you seem to buy into a whole lot of nonsense and lies about pregnancy. If the mother's life is in danger, then so is the baby's! It isn't like you need to KILL a baby to save the mother. If the mother needs to deliver, then you deliver either vaginally or prematurely because if you don't deliver the baby and or mom will might die. The treatment is DELIVERY , not abortion. But, carry on with your abortion LIES that you tell to women.

Fort Worth Mom · Mod/Penguin lover/Princess!

ed11563 wrote:
Flame suit on

Just shut up, please.

You don't know, straight up, about the Catholic Church, and what they teach.

ed, you spread myths, and lies,

I am asking you, nicely...to quit with the bull****.

You really don't know what you're talking about.

And, you really are insulting, the Catholics, on this board.

flan327 · Itty bitty's Grammy

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Some of you seem to buy into a whole lot of nonsense and lies about pregnancy. If the mother's life is in danger, then so is the baby's! It isn't like you need to KILL a baby to save the mother. If the mother needs to deliver, then you deliver either vaginally or prematurely because if you don't deliver the baby and or mom will might die. The treatment is DELIVERY , not abortion. But, carry on with your abortion LIES that you tell to women.

That would depend on several factors, wouldn't it?

flan

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

lilyofcourse wrote:
FWM, I understand that.

I am saying that a mother will choose their child over them self.

Not talking about doctors.

A real mom will not seek out to kill her child.

There are situations where I might choose my life over my unborn child's. If I had several small children at home, it would be damn difficult to make a decision to leave them motherless AND add another child to the household.

You can call me names or think I am a terrible mother. I don't really care. I am just being honest that it would not be a slam dunk decision for me.

Fort Worth Mom · Mod/Penguin lover/Princess!

Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
FWM, I understand that.

I am saying that a mother will choose their child over them self.

Not talking about doctors.

A real mom will not seek out to kill her child.
There are situations where I might choose my life over my unborn child's. If I had several small children at home, it would be damn difficult to make a decision to leave them motherless AND add another child to the household.
You can call me names or think I am a terrible mother. I don't really care. I am just being honest that it would not be a slam dunk decision for me.

And, a lot of Moms would beg a doctor, to save her baby.

Even if it meant that she would die.

I'm sure, that has happened.

But, for ed to say that the Catholic Church/Hospitals...will choose the baby's life, over the Mother's life........is Bull ****.

Enough with the Catholic bashing.

Especially, when it's lies/myths.

Lindley · Guru

Lady Gaga Snerd wrote:
Some of you seem to buy into a whole lot of nonsense and lies about pregnancy. If the mother's life is in danger, then so is the baby's! It isn't like you need to KILL a baby to save the mother. If the mother needs to deliver, then you deliver either vaginally or prematurely because if you don't deliver the baby and or mom will might die. The treatment is DELIVERY , not abortion. But, carry on with your abortion LIES that you tell to women.

I agree. My daughter most likely would have died if they didn't take the baby. Her blood pressure was sky high and had a swollen liver. They took the baby by c section. My granddaughter was a little over a month early.

lilyofcourse · My spirit animal is a pink flamingo.

There is no way I could live with myself if I wasn't 100% sure I did everything to save my child.

And I don't see how any woman could seek out to kill her baby.

That's not a woman, that's not even a human to me.

Mellow Momma · Sniff...sniff, sniff. Yay! A Bum!

Fort Worth Mom wrote:
Mellow Momma wrote:
lilyofcourse wrote:
FWM, I understand that.

I am saying that a mother will choose their child over them self.

Not talking about doctors.

A real mom will not seek out to kill her child.
There are situations where I might choose my life over my unborn child's. If I had several small children at home, it would be damn difficult to make a decision to leave them motherless AND add another child to the household.
You can call me names or think I am a terrible mother. I don't really care. I am just being honest that it would not be a slam dunk decision for me.
And, a lot of Moms would beg a doctor, to save her baby.
Even if it meant that she would die.
I'm sure, that has happened.
But, for ed to say that the Catholic Church/Hospitals...will choose the baby's life, over the Mother's life........is Bull ****.
Enough with the Catholic bashing.
Especially, when it's lies/myths.

I didn't mention you, Ed, or the Catholic Church. Sorry. Wasn't even referring to any of that. Just referring to what lily posted.